Person Page - 2376

     GAV-34.

     Béatrix de Bar married Berchtold IV-I "the Bearded" von Zähringen Herzog von Zähringen, graf im Breisgau, Herzog von Kärnten, marchese di Verona, son of Bezzelin/Bertilo von Villingen Graf in der Ortenau and Luitgard von Nellenburg.²

     Mathilde (?) married Thibaut II (?) de Crépy, son of Adam "le Riche" (?) de Crépy, seigneur de Nanteuil-Le-Haudouin.¹

     Gilles (?) comte de Duras, Montaigu et Clermont married Laurette/Adelheid (?) von Looz, Dame de Longwy, daughter of Ludwig/Louis I (?) Graf von Looz und Rieneck, Burggraf of Mainz and Agnes von Metz, in 1174
;
Her 1st husband.^1,2,3,4 Gilles (?) comte de Duras, Montaigu et Clermont and Laurette/Adelheid (?) von Looz, Dame de Longwy were divorced in 1174.^1,2,3
Gilles (?) comte de Duras, Montaigu et Clermont died before 1193.⁵
      ; Per Med Lands: "LAURETTE (-before 1184). The Genealogica ex Stirpe Sancti Arnulfi names "Loreta filia comitis de Los" as wife of "Theobaldus comes de Monceons"[887]. The Chronicle of Alberic de Trois-Fontaines names "Loretam filiam comitis Ludovici, sororem comitis Geraudi Losensis dyocesis Leodiensis" as first wife of "comes Barri Theobaldus"[888]. The primary source which confirms her first marriage has not yet been identified. Heiress of Longwy. m firstly (divorced 1174) GILLES Comte de Duras, de Montaigu et de Clermont, son of GODEFROI Comte de Montaigu, de Clermont et de Duras & his wife Juliane de Duras (-before 1193). m secondly ([1176]) as his first wife, THIBAUT de Bar Seigneur de Briey, Steinay and Longwy, son of RENAUD II Comte de Bar & his wife Agnes de Blois ([1160]-12/13 Feb 1214, bur Saint-Mihiel). He succeeded his brother in 1190 as THIBAUT I Comte de Bar."
Med Lands cites:

; See entry on Med Lands.⁵

Reference: Genealogics cites: Europäische Stammtafeln, J.A. Stargardt Verlag, Marburg, Schwennicke, Detlev (Ed.) 6:60.⁶

; Per Wikipedia:
     "Gilles (Ægidius) (died before 1193), was Count of Montaigu and Clermont, Count of Duras, son of Count Godefried of Montaigu, and his wife Juliane, daughter of Count Otto of Duras. Gilles was also Seigneur of Rochefort, Seigneur of Jodoigne and advocate of Saint-Trond.
     "In 1174, Gilles married Laurette de Looz, daughter of Louis I, Count of Looz, and his wife Agnes von Metz. They divorced childless in 1176.
     "Gilles contracted leprosy, giving up most of his lands to his brothers Conon and Pierre. [1][2] Gilles was succeeded as Count of Montaigu, Clermont and Duras by his brother Conon, possibly as early as 1175. In a charter dated 1175 donating property to the Knights Hospitaller, Gilles is referred to as former count and his brothers Pierre and Conon as Counts of Montaigu and Duras, respectively. He kept the lordship of Jodoigne and was then at least once referred to as count of Jodoigne. (His mother had also referred to herself as countess of Jodoigne.[3]
     "Leprosy, however, was not the end of his military life, as Gislebert of Mons as he and his brother Conon fought the duke of Louvain, for seizing Duras and Jodoigne, his only remaining allod. They were able to recover Duras. Moreover, he writes of his capture in the town of Namur by Baldwin V, Count of Hainaut, who held him captive for a long time. Gilles and his brothers prepared to go on crusade, though Gilles probably never went ahead with this plan. None of the brothers had heirs, and so arrangements were made for their possessions.
References
1. Chronicle of Hainaut by Gilbert of Mons, translated Laura Napran (Boydell, 2005) ISBN 1-84383-120-1 google
2. "Experiences of Charity 1250-1650," Anne M. Scott (Routledge, 2016) ch.3
3. Hanon de Louvet Vol.1 p.71
Sources
** Hanon de Louvet (1941) Histoire de la Ville de Jodoigne
** Wolters, Joseph Mathias, Notice Historique sur l’Ancien Comté de Duras en Hesbaie, Gyselinck, 1855 (available on Google Books)
External link
** Medieval Lands Project, Comtes de Montaigu: http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/LOTHARINGIAN%20(LOWER)%20NOBILITY.htm#GodefroiMontaigudied1161.⁴ " Gilles (?) comte de Duras, Montaigu et Clermont was also known as Egidius de Montaigu.⁶

      ; abesse de Clairefontaine.¹

     Charles de Bar died; died young.¹

     Eléonore de Bar married Llywellyn ab Owain Lord of Iscoed, son of Owain ap Maredudd and Angharad ferch Owain ap Maredudd.¹

     Béatrice de Bar married Guido I Gonzaga Signore di Mantova.^1,2

     Eramberge (Eramburge, Erneburge) (?) married Raoul (?) d'Ivry, comte de Bayeux et châtelain d’Ivry, son of Esperleng (Asperling, L’ «Eperlan») (?) de Pîtres and AdelaSprote (?) de Bretagne,
; his 2nd wife.¹
     GAV-29.

     ; NB: There is uncertainty about the parents of Roger I de Mortemer.
I. Med Lands: A discussion of the issues is found in Med Lands:
     "According to the Complete Peerage, Roger [I] de Mortemer came from Mortemer-sur-Eaulne, near Neufchâtel-en-Brai (upstream of Dieppe on the river Béthune, in the eastern part of the Pays de Caux) in Normandy, which it says must be distinguished from "Mortemer-en-Lions, the site of the abbey of the same name"[213]. Le Prévost is more specific, stating that he was from "Mortemer-en-Brai, sur la rivière d´Eaulne" and adding "on voit encore l´emplacement du château" (writing in 1840)[214]. Roger [I] is recorded by Orderic Vitalis as having led "omnes Caletenses" (from the Pays de Caux) at the battle of Mortemer against the French in 1054 but that his castle was confiscated after he had helped the escape of one of the French prisoners[215]. Although Roger was later reconciled with the king and recovered some of his lands, the castle of Mortemer remained with the Warenne family. The descendants of Roger [I] continued to bear the name "Mortimer", derived from the castle, despite its early confiscation.
     "There has been considerable debate about the ancestry of Roger [I] de Mortemer. The first question relates to the possible relationship between Roger [I] de Mortemer and William de Warenne 1st Earl of Surrey. This issue is discussed in the Complete Peerage which concludes that "its exact nature has not at present been discovered"[216]. The fact of the family relationship is indicated by Orderic Vitalis who, in a passage recounting an alleged death-bed speech of William I King of England, records that the castle of Mortemer, confiscated from Roger [I] de Mortemer after the battle of Mortemer in 1054, was granted to "Guillelmo de Guarenna consanguineo eius"[217]. In addition to this, Robert de Torigny, in his description of abbeys in Normandy, records that "Rogerius de Mortuo Mari, filius Walterii de Sancto Martino, frater vero primi Willermi de Warenna" founded "monasterium Sancti Victoris"[218]. A third source, Guillaume of Jumièges records that “nepotes...plures...Gunnor...una earum” married “patri primi Willelmi de Warenna” by whom she had “idem Willelmus postea comes Surreiæ et Rogerus de Mortuo-mari frater ipsius” [although an undated charter quoted in the document NORMANDY NOBILITY, which records a sale of property by “Hugo de Flamenvilla”, indicates that Raoul´s second wife was the mother of his son Guillaume][219]. The second source is clearly incorrect as regards the parentage of William de Warenne, whose father is confirmed in other primary sources as Raoul de Warenne (see the document NORMANDY NOBILITY, WARENNE). It is also clear that Roger [I] de Mortemer (already holder of a castle in 1054) must have been considerably older than William de Warenne, and so could hardly have been his brother. Stapleton proposed in 1846 that Roger [I] de Mortimer and Raoul de Warenne, father of William de Warenne 1st Earl of Surrey, were brothers, arguing that, because they are both mentioned in charters of Sainte-Trinité de Rouen in connection with the same property (see below), they had probably inherited it jointly[220].
     "Stapleton also proposed that Roger [I] de Mortemer was the same person as Roger, son of "Bishop Hugues". The question of the identity of Bishop Hugues is discussed in the document NORMANDY NOBILITY. Roger, son of the bishop, is named in three charters, two of which name his father as Bishop Hugues. Firstly, "…ejusdem Rodulfi de Guarethna., Beatricis uxori eius, Rogerii filii episcopi, Huberti filii Turoldi…" witnessed an undated charter which records an agreement between Sainte-Trinité de Rouen and "Rodulfo Warethnæ" to buy land "in Blovilla…apud villam…Merdeplud…et terram prati Sottevillæ"[221]. Secondly, "Rogerius, Hugonis episcopi filius" sold serfs "sub suo dominio in Blovilla et Einardi mansionali et Novillula et in Scurra vel Merdepluet villa…et suæ domus propriæ in urbe Rotomagi" to Sainte-Trinité de Rouen, with the consent of "sua uxore Odain…et eorum filiis Willelmo et Hugone", by undated charter[222]. Thirdly, "Rodulfus de Warenna eiusque conjux…Emma cum filiis suis Rodulfo…atque Willelmo" sold "totius Osulfi Villæ eiusdem Caletensis pagi", sold by "Guillelmo filio Rogerii filii Hugonis episcopi", to Sainte-Trinité de Rouen by charter dated 1074[223]. The Complete Peerage dismisses Stapleton´s hypothesis[224]. It argues firstly that the wife of Roger [I] de Mortemer is named Hawise in primary sources, compared with Oda as the wife of Roger, son of the bishop, and also that the bishop´s son is recorded with children named Guillaume and Hugues, whereas Roger [I]´s heir was named Ralph, although it would not be beyond the stretch of imagination to combine the two families, with Roger having married twice. The third difficulty proposed by the Complete Peerage is harder to dismiss. This is that the 1074 charter quoted above implies that Roger, father of Guillaume, was already deceased at the time of the sale of their property to Raoul de Warenne, whereas sources demonstrate that Roger [I] de Mortemer was still alive in 1078. A further difficulty with Stapleton´s hypothesis is that, if it was correct, the same person would have been referred to in the sources sometimes as "filius episcopi" and sometimes as "de Mortuomari". Such dual appellations are unusual. Different primary sources at the time usually refer to the same individual by the same name and epithet, presumably reflecting the style by which he was normally known among his contemporaries. If a person was known by two names, the style "X qui et Y" was usually adopted in the sources. One possible explanation for this apparent exception to normal practice is that, after the confiscation of his castle, "Rogerius de Mortuomari" became known as "Rogerius filius episcopi", although this does not appear consistent with the survival of the name Mortimer among Roger´s descendants long after the castle was lost."
Med Lands cites:
II. Wikipedia: Wikipedia provides a summary discussion of the debate regarding Roger's origins:
Wikipedia cites:
8. C. P. Lewis, "Mortimer, Ralph (I) de", Oxford Dictionary of National Biography, online
9. L. C. Loyd, "A Note on the Relationship of the Families of Mortimer and Warenne", The New Complete Peerage, vol. 9, Appendix A, pp. 3-7
10. K. S. B. Keats-Rohan, "Aspects of Torigny's Genealogy Revisited", Nottingham Medieval Studies 37:21–27
III. Boyer [2001]: Boyer [2001:166] seems to have assumed that Roger I was the son of Hugues and who m1. Oda/Odain later m2. Hawise. Boyre cites "Weis, Cokayne and Eyton", stating that "The latter presented a chart in hbis Antiquities of Shropshire [4:196] giving Roger de Mortemer as a son of Hugh, Bishop of Coutances in 990, by a daughter of Richard I, Duke of Normandy." The Eyton citation is:
IV. Oxford Dictionary of National Biography:
"Mortimer, Roger (fl. 1054–c. 1080)
C. P. Lewis https://doi.org/10.1093/ref:odnb/19351
Published in print: 23 September 2004; Published online: 23 September 2004; This version: 19 May 2011
DNB Sources:
** GEC, Peerage, new edn, 9.266–7
** Ordericus Vitalis, Eccl. hist., 4.86–9
** D. Bates, ed., Regesta regum Anglo-Normannorum: the acta of William I, 1066–1087 (1998), nos. 101, 245
** K. S. B. Keats-Rohan, ‘Aspects of Robert of Torigny's genealogies revisited’, Nottingham Medieval Studies, 37 (1993), 21–7, at 21–3
** D. C. Douglas, William the Conqueror: the Norman impact upon England (1964), 67–70
** M. Fauroux, ed., Recueil des actes des ducs de Normandie de 911 à 1066 (Caen, 1961), no. 136"
V. Racines et Histoire: Shows Roger as the son of Guillaume de Warrenne (b ca 95), and brother of Raoul de Warenne (b. ca 998). Racines et Histoire cites no sources for this.
Conclusion: I have chosen to follow the origins as outline by Keats-Rohan: that Roger was the son of Rodolf de Warenne and his wife Beatrix. GA Vaut.^2,3,4,5,6,7

     Galeran d'Ivry baron d’Ivry, seigneur de Bréval died at Aquitaine, France (now).¹ He married Agnès de Montreuil-Bellay Dame de Montreuil-Bellay, vicomtesse de Melun, daughter of Gerard de Montreuil-Bellay Seigneur de Montreuil-Bellay and Bathilde (?).¹

     Robert (?) d'Ivry, seigneur d’Ivry et de Bréval was living in 1032.¹

     Ascelin dit «Goël» (?) seigneur d’Ivry et Bréval married Isabelle de Crépon, daughter of Guillaume 1 er «FitzOsbern» de Crépon de Breteuil, comte de Breteuil et d’Hereford and Adelise (Alice) de Toeni.¹

     Isabelle de Crépon married Guillaume/William "Louvel" (?) seigneur d’Ivry et Bréval.¹
Isabelle de Crépon married Ascelin dit «Goël» (?) seigneur d’Ivry et Bréval, son of Robert (?) d'Ivry, seigneur d’Ivry et de Bréval.¹

     Agnès de Montreuil-Bellay Dame de Montreuil-Bellay, vicomtesse de Melun married Galeran d'Ivry baron d’Ivry, seigneur de Bréval, son of Guillaume/William "Louvel" (?) seigneur d’Ivry et Bréval, and Auberée/Maud de Beaumont de Meulan.¹

     Adelina de Grandmesnil married Roger d'Ivry seigneur d’Ivry et Bréval, son of Galeran d'Ivry baron d’Ivry, seigneur de Bréval and Agnès de Montreuil-Bellay Dame de Montreuil-Bellay, vicomtesse de Melun.¹

Adelina de Grandmesnil died between 1110 and 1111.¹

     Roger d'Ivry seigneur d’Ivry et Bréval married Adelina de Grandmesnil, daughter of Hugh I de Grandmesnil Count of Grentmesnil, seigneur de Brokesborne and Adelaide/Aelis de Beaumont-sur-Oise.¹

Roger d'Ivry seigneur d’Ivry et Bréval died after 24 April 1089.¹

     Robert III de Villeneuil vicomte de Blois married Agnès de Beaugency, daughter of Lancelin II (Landry) de Beaugency seigneur de Beaugency and Alberga (?), before February 1069
;
Her 1st husband.^2,4,1,5,3
      ; Per Racines et Histoire (Beaugency): “Agnès de Beaugency ° ~1069 (citée donation de Robert de Villeneuil 02/1069)
     ép. 1) avant 02/1069 Robert de Villeneuil (ou Milon de Montmorency ?)
     ép. 2) ~1070/75 ou peu après et dès 1088 Renaud II, comte de Nevers, Tonnerre et Auxerre (1083) ° ~1055/60 + 05/08/1087 (ou 1089, 1097 ?) (fils de Guillaume 1er, comte de Nevers, et d’Ermengarde, comtesse de Tonnerre ; veuf d’Ide-Raymonde de Forez)
     postérité Nevers, Tonnerre & Auxerre”.¹

; Per Med Lands:
     "AGNES de Baugency . The Origine et Historia Brevi Nivernensium Comitum records that "Guillelmus…[filios]…Renaldum" married secondly "Idam…filiam Lancelini de Balgentiaco"[741]. Her parentage is confirmed by a charter dated 1134 under which "Guillelmus comes Nivernensis, qui fuit natus de filia Lancelini de Baugenciaco" renounced practices which prejudiced the abbey of Saint-Michel[742]. "Rotbertus de Villenolio gener Lancelini" donated property by charter dated Feb 1069 which names "uxorem suam Agnes…et fratrem suum Willelmum", subscribed by "Lancelinus de Balgentiaco, Rodulfus filius eius"[743].
     "m firstly (before Feb 1069) ROBERT de Villeneuil, son of ---.
     "m secondly (1075 or after) as his second wife, RENAUD [II] Comte de Nevers, son of GUILLAUME I Comte de Nevers & his wife Ermengarde Ctss de Tonnerre (-5 Aug 1089)."
Med Lands cites:

; Per Racines et Histoire (Blois): “Robert III de Villeneuil, Vicomte de Blois (se fixe à La Ferté-Nabert : act. -Saint-Aubin)
     ép. Agnès de Beaugency (fille de Lancelin, seigneur de Beaugency)”.²

     Alain de Rieux Seigneur de Rieux married Amaurie d'Estouteville, daughter of Robert I "Grandbois" d'Estouteville seigneur d’Estouteville.^2,1

Alain de Rieux Seigneur de Rieux died after 1065.²
      ; Per Racines et Histoire (d'Estouteville): “Amaurie d’Estouteville ép. Alain de Rieux + après 1065 (fils de Guethenoc, seigneur de Rieux) pour La Morandière) ”.²

; Per Med Lands:
     "AMAURIE d’Estouteville . Morandière states that "Robert I le vieux d’Estouteville et son autre sœur Amaurie ont épousé Blanche et Alain, enfants de Guéthénoc Sire de Rieux" (who he says was descended from a younger son of Alain I Duke of Brittany, who died[ in 907) but cites no primary source on which the information is based[261].
     "m ALAIN Seigneur de Rieux, son of GUETHENOC Seigneur de Rieux & his wife ---.] "
Med Lands cites: [261] Morandière (1903), p. 31.¹

     Briande dit "de Beynes" (?) d’Adhemar de Monteil married Lambert (?) de Thury, seigneur de Lombers
; her 1st husband.^1,2 Briande dit "de Beynes" (?) d’Adhemar de Monteil was born circa 1200.² She married Guy de Montfort châtelain de Bréthencourt, seigneur de Castres, Prévôt puis seigneur, de Beynes, seigneur de La Ferté-Alais et de Gometz, son of Simon V de Montfort 5th Earl of Leicester, Comte de Toulouse, Duc de Narbonne, Marquis de Provence and Amice de Beaumont Countess of Leicester, before July 1224
; his 2nd wife; her 2nd husband.^1,2
      ; douairière de Beynes.¹

     Lambert I Adhémar (?) co-seigneur de Montélimar, seigneur de Monteil, La Garde-Adhémar, Valaurie et La Chaux married Guillemette (?) de Donzère, dame de Pierrelatte et de Châteauneuf-du-Rhône.¹
Lambert I Adhémar (?) co-seigneur de Montélimar, seigneur de Monteil, La Garde-Adhémar, Valaurie et La Chaux married Tiburge de Baux comtesse d’Orange, daughter of Bertrand I de Baux Sire de Baux, Prince d'Orange and Tiburge III (?) Countess d'Orange d’Aumelas dite «de Montpellier», princesse d’Orange, circa 1190 at Panat
; his 1st wife.^8,9,10,11,2
Lambert I Adhémar (?) co-seigneur de Montélimar, seigneur de Monteil, La Garde-Adhémar, Valaurie et La Chaux died after 1227.^9,11
      ; Leo van de Pas cites: Europäische Stammtafeln, J.A. Stargardt Verlag Marburg., Detlev Schwennicke, Editor, Reference: XIV 81.⁹ Lambert I Adhémar (?) co-seigneur de Montélimar, seigneur de Monteil, La Garde-Adhémar, Valaurie et La Chaux was also known as Lamberto Ademaro Consignore di Monteil.¹¹ Lambert I Adhémar (?) co-seigneur de Montélimar, seigneur de Monteil, La Garde-Adhémar, Valaurie et La Chaux was also known as Lambert Adhemar sn de Monteil.^8,11 He was living in 1184.¹²

     Guillemette (?) de Donzère, dame de Pierrelatte et de Châteauneuf-du-Rhône married Lambert I Adhémar (?) co-seigneur de Montélimar, seigneur de Monteil, La Garde-Adhémar, Valaurie et La Chaux, son of Giraud Adhémar I (?) seigneur de Montélimar, Monteil et Grignan and Garsende (Ermesinde) de Poitiers-Valentinois.¹

     Eléonore de Montfort died before 1238.¹
     She was religieuse à l’abbaye Saint-Antoine de Paris at Abbaye de St. Antoine-des-Champs, Paris, City of Paris, Île-de-France, France.¹

     Guy II de Lévis married Jeanne (?) Jeanne de Bruyères before 1234.²

     Jeanne (?) Jeanne de Bruyères married Guy II de Lévis before 1234.¹

Jeanne (?) Jeanne de Bruyères died before 1269.¹