Paule (?) du Maine1

F, #4831, d. 1095
FatherHeribert I "Eveille-Chien" (?) Comte de Maine b. c 985, d. 13 Apr 1036; see notes from The Henry Project1,2
ReferenceGAV25
Last Edited4 Jun 2020
     Paule (?) du Maine married Jean de Beaugency Seigneur de La Flèche, son of Lancelin 1er (Landry) de Beaugency seigneur de Beaugency et de la Flèche.3,4
Paule (?) du Maine was buried in 1095 at Collégiale Saint-Pierre-la-Cour, Le Mans, Departement de la Sarthe, Pays de la Loire, France (now),

; From Find A Grave:
     BIRTH     unknown, Le Mans, Departement de la Sarthe, Pays de la Loire, France
     DEATH     1095, Le Mans, Departement de la Sarthe, Pays de la Loire, France
     Children:
** Élie I du Maine, son Elias would succeed his first cousin Hugh V as Count of Maine
** (Helias), d. 11 July 1110, lord of La Flèche and count of Maine.
** Gosbert, a monk
** Enoch, a monk
** Geoffroy
** Lancelin
** Miles
** Guillaume
     Family Members
     Parents
      Herbert I du Maine unknown–1035
     Spouse
      Jean de la Fleche de Beaugency 1030–1097
     Siblings
      Hugues IV du Maine unknown–1051
     Children
      Élie I du Maine unknown–1110
     BURIAL     Collégiale Saint-Pierre-la-Cour, Le Mans, Departement de la Sarthe, Pays de la Loire, France
     Created by: Memerizion
     Added: 5 Feb 2016
     Find A Grave Memorial 157850263.5
Paule (?) du Maine died in 1095 at Le Mans, Departement de la Sarthe, Pays de la Loire, France (now).5
     Paule (?) du Maine was a witness to the Racines et Histoire (Beaugency) says Jean married "Herberge d'Este" (b ca 1072 d bef 1110). However, The Henry Project and Genelaogics both say he married Pauline du Maine.

Per Racines et Histoire (BEaugency): "Jean de Beaugency dit «de La Flèche» ° ~1047 + avant 1097 (1095 ?) seigneur de La Flèche (1060)
     ép. ~1075/85 Herberge d’Este dite «du Maine» ° ~1072 + avant 1110 (1109 ?) (fille d’Ugo V d’Este et d’Heria de Hauteville) " with Jean de Beaugency Seigneur de La Flèche.6,4,7

Paule (?) du Maine and Jean de Beaugency Seigneur de La Flèche
Per Med Lands:
     "JEAN de la Flèche, son of LANCELIN [I] de Baugency & his wife --- (-[1097], bur Angers, Saint-Aubin). Son of Lancelin according to Orderic Vitalis, who says that his mother was the daughter of the Comte du Maine[175], which appears to result from confusion with his wife. "Domna Agnes comitissa" [wife of Geoffroy II "Martel" Comte d´Anjou] bought "ecclesiam Sancti-Beati…juxta…castrum Vindocini" from "Lancelino dominico vasso de castro Balgentiaco" and "apud Castrum-Dunum alteram ecclesiam" from "filiis eiusdem Lancelino…Johanne et Lancelino" by charter dated to before 1040[176]. A charter dated 13 Feb 1087 records donations to Angers Saint-Aubin by "Johannes de Fissa", with the consent of "Helias filius eius"[177]. A charter dated to [1097] records that "Johannes de Fissa" became a monk after falling ill at Château-Gonthier and died soon after[178]. A charter dated to [1097] records confirmation of donations to Angers Saint-Aubin by "Elias…filius eius…et frater eius Gaufridus" after the burial of their father[179].
     "m PAULE du Maine, daughter of HERIBERT [I] "Eveille-chien" Comte du Maine & his wife --- ([1025/35]-). Orderic Vitalis records that "Hugo filius Herberti" and his wife “Bertam ipsius relictam, Tedbaldi Blesensium comitis sororem” had “filium...Herbertum et tres filias”, of whom the third married “Johanni domino castri...Flecchia” (which would be difficult to sustain chronologically and confuses the children of Hugues [IV] Comte du Maine with his sisters) and had three children “Goisbertum, Heliam et Enoch”[180]. Her father is named by Orderic Vitalis, who also records her marriage to "Lancelin de Beaugency"[181]. However, in another passage the same source names "Helias, Johannis et Paulæ filius, Hugonis Cenomannorum consulis consobrinus"[182]. From a chronological point of view, it is more likely that Jean, son of Lancelin de Baugency, was the husband of Paule du Maine."
Med Lands cites:
[175] Orderic Vitalis (Chibnall), Vol. IV, Book VIII, p. 197.
[176] Vendôme La Trinité, Tome I, XXII, p. 42.
[177] Angers Saint-Aubin, Tome II, DCCXLVI, p. 237.
[178] Angers Saint-Aubin, Tome II, DCCXLVIII, p. 239.
[179] Angers Saint-Aubin, Tome II, DCCXLIX, p. 240.
[180] Orderic Vitalis (Prévost), Vol. II, Liber IV, XII, p. 252.
[181] Orderic Vitalis (Chibnall), Vol. IV, Book VIII, p. 197.
[182] Orderic Vitalis (Chibnall), Vol. II, Book IV, p. 305.8


Paule (?) du Maine
NB: Racines et Histoire (Maine and Beaugency) both say that Paule married Lancelin I de Beaugency. However, The Henry Project, Genealogics and Med Lands argue that she in fact m. Lancelin's son, Jean de Beaugency.
Conclusion: I have chosen to follow The Henry Project, Genealogics and Med Lands. GA Vaut.9,10,11,12,8,13,14

Paule (?) du Maine
Per The Henry Project: Paula, Wife of Jean de La Flèche.
     "Paula does not appear in any known contemporary document. She appears by name only in a passage of Orderic Vitalis naming the parents of Hélie de La Flèche ["Helias Iohannis et Paulæ filius..." OV x, 8 (vol. 5, pp. 228-9)].
     "Date of Birth: Unknown.
     "Place of Birth: Unknown.
     "Date of Death: Unknown.
     "Place of Death: Unknown.
     "Father: Uncertain.
     "Mother: Uncertain.
The parentage of Paula is discussed in detail below in the commentary section.
     "Spouse: Jean, d. after 13 February 1087, lord of La Flèche.
Children: [See the Commentary section for quotes from the relevant sections of Orderic Vitalis.]
     "MALE Helias, d. 11 July 1110, lord of La Flèche and count of Maine.
     "MALE Gosbert, a monk.
     "MALE Enoch, a monk
     "MALE Geoffroy.
     "MALE Lancelin.
     "MALE Miles.
     "MALE Guillaume (William).
Commentary
     "The ancestry of Paula is subject to a considerable amount of confusion, due to the contradictory nature of the sources. The main problem is the testimony of Orderic Vitalis, who contradicts himself on a number of points. We first give quotes from the four groups of data provided by Orderic, and then quote some other important sources.
     "Orderic Vitalis (Book 3) - "Anno ab incarnatione Domini mlxivº post mortem Herberti iuuenis Cenomannensium comitis ... Præfatus nimirum iuuenis post obitum Herberti senioris patris sui qui uulgo Euigilans Canem cognominabatur, propter grauissimus infestationes quas a perfidis affinibus suis Andegauensibus incessanter partiebatur consilio Bertæ matris suæ se suumque patrimonium fortissimo duci Normannorum commendauerat, et Margaritam sororem suam Rodberto eiusdem ducis filio in coniugium dederat cum qua hæreditatem suam comitatum scilicet Cenomannensem si sine liberis obiret concesserat. Sed quia Walterius Pontesiensium comes filius Drogonis comitis qui cum Rodberto seniore Normannorum duce in Ierusalem ierat, et in illo itinere peregrinus obierat Biotam Hugonis Cenomannensium comitis filiam, quæ amita prædicti iuuenis erat, in coniugium habebat, totum comitatum Cenomannensem calumniabatur et ex parte possidebat." [OV iii (vol. 2, pp. 116-7)] The information in this passage is corrupt compared to other sources, including other passages of Orderic. Orderic's statement in Book 3 would make more sense if we assumed that he accidently switched Herbert "Wake-dog" and Hugues in this passage.
     "Orderic Vitalis (Book 4) - "Herbertus Cenomannorum comes ex prosapia ut fertur Karoli Magni originem duxit et uulgo sed parum latine cognominari Euigilans-canem pro ingenti probitate promeruit. Nam post mortem Hugonis patris sui ... Hugo filius Herberti postquam Alannus Britannorum comes a Normannis in Normannia impotionatus occubuit Bertam ipsius relictam Tedbaldi Blesensium comitis sororem in coniugium accepit, quæ filium nomine Herbertum et tres filias ei peperit. Vna earum data est Azsoni marchiso Liguriæ. Alia nomine Margarita Rodberto filio Guillelmi ducis Neustriæ desponsata est quæ uirgo in tutela eiusdem ducis defuncta est. Tercia uero Iohanni domino castri quod Flecchia dicitur nupsit quæ marito suo tres liberos Goisbertum, Heliam et Enoch peperit." [OV iv (vol. 2, pp. 304-5)]
     "Orderic Vitalis (Book 8) - "Anno ab incarnatione Domini MºXCº indictione xiiiª Cenomanni contra Normannos rebellauerunt, eiectisque custodibus eorum de munitionibus nouum principem sibi constituerunt. Nam qui uiuente Guillelmo rege contra eum rebellare multociens conati sunt ipso mortuo statim de rebellione machinari ceperunt. Legationem igitur filiis Azonis marchisi Liguriæ direxerunt... Tandem diffinierunt ut Fulco qui maior natu erat patris honorem in Italia possideret Hugo autem frater eius Cenomannensem principatum ex matris hereditate sibi reposceret. ... Tandem Helias consobrinus eius ad eum [i.e., to Hugo] accessit... Hæc ita dicenti Hugo manifeste propalauit Heliæ, quod suum uellet consulatum uendere patriosque penates reuisere. Helias dixit, 'Cognatus tuus sum domine, suffragioque meo sullimatus es in consulatus honore quem nulli potes nisi michi dare uel uendere. Nam filia Herberti comitis Lancelino de Balgenceio nupsit eique Lancelinum Radulfi patrem et Iohannem meum genitorem peperit. ...' His dictus ignauus Allobrox annuit et pro comitatu Cenomannensi decem milia solidorum Cenomannensis monetæ recepit. Helias uero recedente Ligure comes Cenomannorum factus est et xx annis adepto consulatu strenue potitus est. Heres quoque soceri sui Geruasii de Castro Ligeri factus est, cuius filiam habuit, ex qua filiam nomine Eremburgem genuit quam domini sui filio Fulconi Andegauorum comiti in matrimonium copulauit." OV viii, 11 (vol. 4, pp. 192-9)
     "Orderic Vitalis (Book 10) - "Helias Iohannis et Paulæ filius, Hugonis Cenomannorum consulis consobrinus, uir multis erga Dei cultum honestatibus uiguit, populique regimen in timore Dei salubriter seruauit. Hic generosam coniugum Mathildem filiam Geruasii accepit qui Rodberti cognomento Brochardi fratris Geruasii Remorum archiepiscopi filius fuit. Huic sex fratres fuerunt, quorum duo priores Goisbertus et Enoch post militiam monachi facti sunt reliqui uero quattuor Ioffredus et Lanscelinus, Milo et Guillelmus immatura morte preuenti sunt. Helias de paterna hereditate Flechiam castrum possedit, quattuor uero castella de patrimonio uxoris suæ optinuit, id est Ligerim et Maiatum, Luceium et Vstilliacum. Vxor eius ei filiam Eremburgem nomine peperit, quæ nubilibus annis Fulconi Andegauorum tunc comiti nunc Ierusolimorum regi nupsit, et generosam sobolem genuit, Iosfredum et Heliam, Mathildem et Sibillam, quæ filiis regem solenniter nupserunt, sed Deo irreprehensibiliter omnia disponente cito uiduatæ sunt." [OV x, 8 (vol. 5, pp. 228-9)] Here, in addition to being the source which supplies us with Paula's name, we have a list of her seven sons, including the ones who died young.
     "Guillaume de Poiters - "Hugo hereditatem suam Hereberto reliquit filio... ." [Guillaume de Poitiers, i, 37 (pp. 58-9)]; "... Gualterium Medantinum comitem, cui soror Hugonis nupserat... ." [ibid., i, 38 (pp. 60-1)]; "[Guillelmus] Voluit in omne seculum et progeniei suae optime consultum fuisse prudens uictor, pius parens. Idcirco germanam Hereberti, ex partibus Teutonum suae munificentiae maximis impensis adductam, nato suo coniugare decreuit, ut per eam ipse et progeniti, ex ipso iure, quod nulla controuersia conuelli posset uel infirmari, Hereberti haereditatem possiderent sororius et nepotes. ... Haec generosa uirgo, nomine Margarita ..." ]ibid., i, 39 (pp. 62-3)]; Guillaume also mentions the elder count Herbert of Maine in the beginning of his account, but does not give his relationship to the later counts [ibid., i, 37 (pp. 58-9)].
     "Actus Pontificum Cenomannis - "... et mittentes in Italiam Athonem quemdam, marchisium, cum uxore et filio, qui vocabatur Hugo... [Act. Pont. Cenom. 376] "... Erat autem uxor ejusdem marchisii, Gercendis nomine, filia Herberti, Cenomannorum illustrissimi comitis, qui vocatus est Evigila Canem; que de primo quidem Theobaldo, duci Campanie, in matrimonium tradita, sed ab eo, repudio interveniente discedens, prefati Athonis postmodum fuerat copulata conjugio." [Act. Pont. Cenom., 377]
     "The succession of count Herbert "Wake-dog", Hugues IV (son of Herbert), and Herbert II (son of Hugh IV) is a straightforward consequence of information from Act. Pont. Cenom. and charter evidence (see the pages of Herbert I and Hugues IV for more), and is also one of the contradictory scenarios given by Orderic. The problem comes from trying to determine the correct relationships of various female members of the dynasty and the eventual inheritance of the county of Maine by the lords of La Flèche. For three of these women, the contradictions can be corrected with a reasonable degree of confidence:
* Gersende, wife of Thibaut III/I of Blois-Champagne, then of Azzo of Liguria (Este) - According to the Actus, she was a daughter of Herbert "Wake-dog" and wife successively of Thibaud of Champagne (who repudiated her) and marquis Atho (i.e., Azzo). In Book 4, Orderic would make her a daughter of Hugues IV. Thibaud's repudiation of Gersende occurred before the coucil of Reims in 1049 [RHF 11: 523; see Arbois de Jubainville (1859-1866), 1: 393], and it is therefore chronologically impossible for her to have been a daughter of Hugues IV (who was not married until 1045×7), so she must have been a daughter of Herbert I, as the Actus states.
* Biote, wife of Gautier of Mantes (Vexin) - Guillaume de Poiters (who does not name her) makes her a sister of Hugues IV. In his confused account of Book 3, Orderic gives contradictory indications, calling her an amita of the young count Herbert (which would agree with Guillaume), but also calling her a daughter of Hugues. Since Orderic was describing events of 1064, the chronology clearly favors Guillaume's account.
* Margaret, fiancé of Robert of Normandy - Guillaume de Poiters calls her a daughter of Hugues IV. Book 4 of Orderic would agree with this. Book 3 of Orderic makes her a sister of Herbert II, who is erroneously given there as a son of Herbert I. Robert de Torigny, in his additions to GND, makes her a daughter of count Herbert ["..., quod Margarita, filia Herberti quondam Cinomannensis comitis..." GND (Rob. Tor.), viii, 2 (vol. 2, pp. 202-3)]. Here, placing Margaret as a daughter of Hugues IV would make her roughly the same age as Robert.

     "However, the ancestry of Paula and the exact manner of the inheritance of the county of Maine by the lords of La Flèche are problematic. All plausible scenarios would make Hélie de La Flèche a descendant of count Herbert I "Wake-dog" of Maine. There is not much precise chronological information available, but we can still narrow things down a little. Hugues IV and his wife Berthe were married between 14 May 1045 and 14 May 1047 [Latouche (1910), 28, n. 4; 144; see the page of Hugues IV for more details], and Hélie's grandson Geoffroy Plantagenet was born on 24 August 1113 [Chr. S. Albini Andegav.]. From this, we can see that that it is chronologically impossible for Hélie to have been a great-grandson of Hugues IV (which would give four generations in less than 68 years). It is chronologically possible for Hélie to have been a maternal grandson of Huges IV, but that would lead to a rather tight chronology, and the birthdate of Hélie would have to be placed in the general neighborhood of 1070. Similarly, it is improbable that there was chronological room for Hélie to have been a great-great-grandson of Hugues IV's father Herbert "Wake-dog". Thus, we can conclude with a reasonable degree of probability that Hélie was either a grandson or great-grandson of Herbert "Wake-dog".
     "Here the lack of other data forces us to rely on Orderic Vitalis, and the combination of information from Books 4, 8, and 10, while not directly contradictory, would give us the rather unlikely scenario that the passing of the county of Maine to Hélie de La Flèche was due to two intermarriages, the second one between first cousins (as shown in the following table).
     "This double marriage is improbable. In particular, when Hélie describes his right of inheritance to Maine, it is unlikely that he would tout a relationship through his paternal grandmother if he were in fact also a maternal grandson of a count of Maine. Also, such first cousin marriages that would be implied by accepting both Book 4 and Book 8 were actively opposed by the church. Thus, it is very unlikely that the accounts of Book 4 and Book 8 are both correct, so it seems reasonable to conclude that there was a single marriage which resulted in the inheritance of Maine by Hélie de La Flèche, and that Orderic was confused about the exact nature of this relationship. Thus, rejecting the double marriage, and assuming that we are correct in making Hélie a grandson or great-grandson of Herbert "Wake-dog", we have four possible scenarios:
     "Scenario 1: Book 4 is correct, and Hélie's mother Paula was a daughter of count Hugues IV.
Although we cannot rule this scenario out directly, two noticeable negative factors can be pointed out. One is the somewhat tight chronology already indicated above. The other is that such a descent would make Hélie a clearly stronger heir in 1090 than Hugues son of Azzo, making it unclear why the nobles of Maine would have brought in an heir from Italy when a stronger claimant was available among their own people. Thus, this scenario seems less likely than some of the others.
     "Scenario 2: Book 8 is correct, and Hélie's claim was through his paternal grandmother, a daughter of count Herbert I "Wake-dog" (in which case Paula's parentage would be unknown).
It has widely been assumed that Hélie's mother Paula (assuming Orderic gives her name correctly) was the heiress of Maine, and that Hélie's claim to Maine was through her. Indeed, this assumption has expanded to the point that Anselme, in accepting the account of Orderic's Book 4, has assigned "Paule" as the name of the wife of Lancelin de Baugency, said to be daughter of count Herbert I [Anselme 3: 170]. If we knew that for sure that Paula was the heiress, we could reject this scenario. However, there does not appear to be any definitive reason to make this assumption. In 1090, the Manceaux rebelled against the Normans, and the countship of Maine was given to Hugues V, son of Azzo of Este and Gersende of Maine, who was brought from Italy to become count [OV viii, 11 (vol. 4, pp. 192-9)]. Only later was the countship purchased from Hugues V to the other claimant Hélie de La Flèche. If Hélie was only a great-grandson of a count of Maine (rather than a grandson), that would fit well enough with Orderic's account in Book 4.
     "Scenario 3: Hélie's mother Paula was a daughter of Herbert I "Wake-dog".
This scenario was the one preferred by Latouche, and he has been followed by many others since then [Latouche (1910), 113-5 (Appendice III)]. Latouche's account starts with a table intended to show what Orderic Vitalis states about the relationships. Unfortunately, because Orderic contradicts himself on several points, it is not really feasible to give a single table showing his statements about the counts of Maine, so the result is that Latouche's tabular outline of Orderic's account is misleading. Making the point that the first cousin marriage implied by Orderic is improbable, Latouche points out that Orderic erroneously assigns two daughters of Herbert I "Wake-dog" as children of Hugues IV, and concludes that he has made the same mistake with Paula. In addition to the lack of any direct evidence, the greatest difficulty with this scenario is the fact that one would have to reject both of Orderic's accounts of Hélie's ancestry as incorrect, and incorporate elements of each. Although it remains a reasonable possibility, it is difficult to regard Latouche's solution as definitive.
     "Scenario 4: Hélie's mother Paula was a granddaughter of Herbert I "Wake-dog" through a child other than Hugues IV.
This scenario has been included on the list for completeness, because it represents the other way in which Hélie might be a great-grandson of Herbert "Wake-dog". However, there is no good reason to believe that this alternative was true.
     "In conclusion, even though we can reject Scenario 4 as being improbable, and Scenario 1 seems less likely than the rest, it does not seem possible to single out one of the scenarios as being obviously preferable. Scenarios 2 and 3, and to a lesser degree Scenario 1, all remain possible.
     "Three possible alternatives for the parentage of Paula
** Possible father: Herbert I "Wake Dog", count of Maine.
** Possible father: NN (not of Maine).
** Possible father (less likely): Hugues IV, count of Maine.
** Possible mother (less likely): Berthe, daughter of Eudes, count of Blois.

     "Falsely attributed father: Hugues V, count of Maine, son of marquis Alberto Azzo II and Gersende de Maine.
[Anselme 3: 173] The chronology is impossible. This is undoubtedly a corrupt version coming from Robert de Torigny's additions to GND, which suggest that Paula's son Hélie was once betrothed to a daughter of his Hugues V ["Interea Cinomannenses ... consilium ineunt cum Helia, filio Iohannis de Fleca, uiro forti et industrio et in illa prouincia potentissimo, ut filiam cuiusdam comitis Langobardie, neptem uidelicet Herberti, quondam Cinomannensis comitis, ex primogenita filia in matrimoniam ducat..." GND (Rob. Tor.), viii, 5 (vol. 2, pp. 208-9)].
Bibliography
** Act. Pont. Cenom. = Busson & Ledru, eds., Actus Pontificum Cenomannis in urbe Degentium (Archives Historiques de Maine 2, Le Mans, 1902).
** Anselme = Père Anselme, Histoire généalogique et chronologique de la maison royale de France, 9 vols (Paris, 1726-33).
** Arbois de Jubainville (1859-1866) = H. Arbois de Jubainville, Histoire des ducs et des comtes de Champagne, 6 vols. (Paris, 1859-1866).
** Cart. Trinité de Vendôme = Charles Métais, Cartulaire de l'abbaye cardinale de la Trinité de Vendôme, 2 vols. (Paris, 1893).
** GND = Guillaume de Jumièges, Gesta Normannorum Ducum, as edited in Elisabeth van Houts, ed. & trans., The Gesta Normannorum Ducum of William of Jumièges, Orderic Vitalis and Robert of Torigni, 2 vols., (Oxford, 1992). Citation is by book and chapter of Guillaume's work, with the volume and page number of the edition by van Houts in parentheses. Unless otherwise stated, references are to Guillaume's work, and not to later additions by such authors as Orderic Vitalis and Robert de Torigni.
** GND (Rob. Tor.) = Additions to GND by Robert de Torigni.
** Guillaume de Poiters = R.H.C. Davis and Marjorie Chibnall, ed. & trans, The Gesta Guillelmi of William of Poitiers (Oxford, New York, 1998).
** Halphen (1903) = Louis Halphen, ed., Recueil d'annales angevines et vendômoises (Paris, 1903).
** Latouche (1910) = Robert Latouche, Histoire de comté du Maine (Paris, 1910).
** OV = Marjorie Chibnall, ed. & trans., The Ecclesiastical History of Orderic Vitalis, 6 vols. (Oxford, 1969-80).

Compiled by Stewart Baldwin
     Uploaded 10 January 2008."15 GAV-25.

Reference: Genealogics cites: Europäische Stammtafeln, J.A. Stargardt Verlag Marburg., Detlev Schwennicke, Editor, Reference: III 692.10


Paule (?) du Maine and Jean de Beaugency Seigneur de La Flèche
Per Med Lands:
     "PAULE du Maine ([1025/35]-). Orderic Vitalis records that "Hugo filius Herberti" and his wife “Bertam ipsius relictam, Tedbaldi Blesensium comitis sororem” had “filium...Herbertum et tres filias”, of whom the third married “Johanni domino castri...Flecchia” (which would be difficult to sustain chronologically and confuses the children of Hugues [IV] Comte du Maine with his sisters) and had three children “Goisbertum, Heliam et Enoch”[169]. Her father is named by Orderic Vitalis, who also records her marriage to "Lancelin de Beaugency"[170]. However, in another passage the same source names "Helias, Johannis et Paulæ filius, Hugonis Cenomannorum consulis consobrinus"[171]. From a chronological point of view, it is more likely that Jean, son of Lancelin de Baugency, was the husband of Paule du Maine.
     "m JEAN de la Flèche, son of LANCELIN de Baugency & his wife --- (-before [1097]), bur Angers, Saint-Aubin)."
Med Lands cites:
[169] Orderic Vitalis (Prévost), Vol. II, Liber IV, XII, p. 252.
[170] Orderic Vitalis (Chibnall), Vol. IV, Book VIII, p. 197.
[171] Orderic Vitalis (Chibnall), Vol. II, Book IV, p. 305.13

Citations

  1. [S1490] Genealogics Website (oiginated by Leo van de Pas, continued by Ian Fettes), online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Paule du Maine: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00029099&tree=LEO. Hereinafter cited as Genealogics Website.
  2. [S1702] The Henry Project: The ancestors of king Henry II of England, An experiment in cooperative medieval genealogy on the internet, online http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/henry.htm, Herbert I "Éveille-Chien" ("Wake-Dog") (Herbertus Evigilans Canem): http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/prov/herbe000.htm. Hereinafter cited as The Henry Project.
  3. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Paule du Maine: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00029107&tree=LEO
  4. [S1702] The Henry Project, online http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/henry.htm, http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/prov/john0000.htm
  5. [S2374] Find a Grave, online http://www.findagrave.com/, Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 12 October 2019), memorial page for Paula du Maine (unknown–1095), Find A Grave Memorial no. 157850263, citing Collégiale Saint-Pierre-la-Cour, Le Mans, Departement de la Sarthe, Pays de la Loire, France ; Maintained by Memerizion (contributor 48072664), at: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/157850263/paula-du_maine. Hereinafter cited as Find a Grave.
  6. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Jean: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00029107&tree=LEO
  7. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, Seigneurs de Beaugency, p. 2: http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Beaugency.pdf. Hereinafter cited as Racines et Histoire.
  8. [S2203] Foundation for Medieval Genealogy (FMG): MEDIEVAL LANDS - A prosopography of medieval European noble and royal families, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/MAINE.htm#JeanFlechedied1097. Hereinafter cited as FMG Medieval Lands Website.
  9. [S1702] The Henry Project, online http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/henry.htm, Paula: http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/prov/paula000.htm
  10. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Paule du Maine: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00029099&tree=LEO
  11. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, Comtes & vicomtes du Maine, p. 4: http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Maine.pdf
  12. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, Seigneurs de Beaugency - ancien Boisgency, p. 2: http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Beaugency.pdf
  13. [S2203] FMG Medieval Lands Website, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/MAINE.htm#PauleMJeanFlechedied1097
  14. [S1549] "Author's comment", various, Gregory A. Vaut (e-mail address), to unknown recipient (unknown recipient address), 4 June 2020; unknown repository, unknown repository address. Hereinafter cited as "GA Vaut Comment."
  15. [S1702] The Henry Project, online http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/henry.htm, Paula: http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/prov/paula000.htm

Gervais II (?) seigneur de Château-du-Loir1,2,3

M, #4832, b. 1043, d. before 1097
FatherRobert I dit Brochard (?) seigneur de Château-du-Loir1,4,2,3
MotherElisabeth (?)5,1,2,3 b. b 1067, d. c 1095
ReferenceGAV25 EDV26
Last Edited23 Nov 2019
     Gervais II (?) seigneur de Château-du-Loir was born in 1043 at Chateau-du-Loir, Departement de la Sarthe, Pays de la Loire, France (now).6 He married Eremburge (?), daughter of Mathilde (?);
His 1st wife (per The Henry Project.)1,7,2
Gervais II (?) seigneur de Château-du-Loir was buried circa 1095 at Fontevraud Abbey (his body), Fontevraud-l'Abbaye, Departement de Maine-et-Loire, Pays de la Loire, France,

; From Find A Grave:
     BIRTH     1043, Chateau-du-Loir, Departement de la Sarthe, Pays de la Loire, France
     DEATH     1095 (aged 51–52), Departement de la Loire, Rhône-Alpes, France
     Family Members
     Spouse
          Erembourge de Chateau du Loire 1040–1092
     Children
          Matilde de Chateau du Loire 1060–1108
     BURIAL     Fontevraud Abbey, Fontevraud-l'Abbaye, Departement de Maine-et-Loire, Pays de la Loire, France
     Created by: Memerizion
     Added: 6 Feb 2016
     Find A Grave Memorial 157881776
     SPONSORED BY Christian H. F. Riley.6 He married Gersende (?) before 1097;
His 2nd wife (per The Henry Project). The Henry Project cites: Cart. Château-du-Loir = Eugène Vallée, Cartulaire de Château-du-Loir (Archives Historiques du Maine 6, Le Mans, 1905). 32-3.2
Gervais II (?) seigneur de Château-du-Loir died before 1097 at Departement de la Loire, Rhône-Alpes, France (now).1,6
     Reference: Genealogics cites: Europäische Stammtafeln, J.A. Stargardt Verlag Marburg., Detlev Schwennicke, Editor, Reference: XIII 68.8


Gervais II (?) seigneur de Château-du-Loir
Per The Henry Project:
     "Gervaise II de Château-du-Loir, Lord of Château-du-Loir, ca. 1067-ca. 1095×1097.
     "Gervais II first appears as lord of Château-du-Loir about 1067, shortly after the death of his uncle Gervais I. After his death, the lordship passed to his son-in-law count Helias of Maine, and then to the counts of Anjou via Éremburge, daughter of Helias.
     "Date of Birth: Unknown.
     "Place of Birth: Unknown.
     "Date of Death: ca. 1095×1097. [Cart. Château-du-Loir 32-3]
     "Place of Death: Unknown.
     "Father: Robert de Château-du-Loir [OV x, 8 (v. 5, pp. 228-9); Cart. Château-du-Loir 11, 15, 19-21].
     "Mother: Elizabeth, fl. 1067×ca. 1095. Elisabeth was named as the mother of Gervais in several charters [Cart. Château-du-Loir 15-6, 25, 32-3].
Spouses:
     "(1) m. bef. 1067×1068 Éremburge, living 1086, d. bef. 1095×1097.
     "(2) m. bef. 1095×1097 Gersende, living ca. 1097. [Cart. Château-du-Loir 32-3]
Child (by Éremburge): [OV x, 8 (v. 5, pp. 228-9); Cart. Château-du-Loir 32-3]
     "FEMALE Mathilde de Château-du-Loir, m. Helias de La Flèche, count of Maine.
See Commentary for supposed additional child.
Commentary
     "Falsely attributed child: Hugues. Said to be son and successor of Gervais, to have married an illegitimate daughter of an unnamed king of England, and to have died without issue [Anselme 6: 246-7, with no sources given]. There does not seem to be any good reason to accept this information.
Bibliography
** Anselme = Père Anselme, Histoire généalogique et chronologique de la maison royale de France, 9 vols. (Paris, 1726-33).
** Cart. Château-du-Loir = Eugène Vallée, Cartulaire de Château-du-Loir (Archives Historiques du Maine 6, Le Mans, 1905).
** OV = Marjorie Chibnall, ed. & trans., The Ecclesiastical History of Orderic Vitalis, 6 vols. (Oxford, 1969-80).

Compiled by Stewart Baldwin.2 GAV-25 EDV-26 GKJ-26.

Family 2

Gersende (?)

Citations

  1. [S1490] Genealogics Website (oiginated by Leo van de Pas, continued by Ian Fettes), online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Gervais: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00141488&tree=LEO. Hereinafter cited as Genealogics Website.
  2. [S1702] The Henry Project: The ancestors of king Henry II of England, An experiment in cooperative medieval genealogy on the internet, online http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/henry.htm, http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/prov/gerva000.htm. Hereinafter cited as The Henry Project.
  3. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Bellême.pdf, p. 3. Hereinafter cited as Racines et Histoire.
  4. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Robert dit Brochard de Château-du-Loir: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00141486&tree=LEO
  5. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Elisabeth: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00141487&tree=LEO
  6. [S2374] Find a Grave, online http://www.findagrave.com/, Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 22 November 2019), memorial page for Gervais II de Château-du-Loir (1043–1095), Find A Grave Memorial no. 157881776, citing Fontevraud Abbey, Fontevraud-l'Abbaye, Departement de Maine-et-Loire, Pays de la Loire, France ; Maintained by Memerizion (contributor 48072664), at: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/157881776/gervais_ii-de_ch_teau_du_loir. Hereinafter cited as Find a Grave.
  7. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Eremburge: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00141489&tree=LEO
  8. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Gervais: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00141488&tree=LEO
  9. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Matilda: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00029109&tree=LEO
  10. [S1702] The Henry Project, online http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/henry.htm, http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/prov/helia000.htm

Eremburge (?)1

F, #4833, b. circa 1040, d. 1092
MotherMathilde (?)2
ReferenceGAV25 EDV26
Last Edited22 Nov 2019
     Eremburge (?) was born circa 1040 at Chateau-du-Loir, Departement de la Sarthe, Pays de la Loire, France (now).3 She married Gervais II (?) seigneur de Château-du-Loir, son of Robert I dit Brochard (?) seigneur de Château-du-Loir and Elisabeth (?);
His 1st wife (per The Henry Project.)4,1,5
Eremburge (?) was buried in 1092 at Fontevraud Abbey (his body), Fontevraud-l'Abbaye, Departement de Maine-et-Loire, Pays de la Loire, France,

; From Find A Grave:
     BIRTH     1040, Chateau-du-Loir, Departement de la Sarthe, Pays de la Loire, France
     DEATH     1092 (aged 51–52), Departement de la Somme, Picardie, France
     Family Members
     Spouse
          Gervais II de Château-du-Loir 1043–1095
     Children
          Matilde de Chateau du Loire 1060–1108
     BURIAL     Fontevraud Abbey, Fontevraud-l'Abbaye, Departement de Maine-et-Loire, Pays de la Loire, France
     Created by: Memerizion
     Added: 6 Feb 2016
     Find A Grave Memorial 157882095
     SPONSORED BY Christian H. F. Riley.6
Eremburge (?) died in 1092 at Departement de la Somme, Picardie, France.3
     Reference: Genealogics cites: Europäische Stammtafeln, J.A. Stargardt Verlag Marburg., Detlev Schwennicke, Editor, Reference: XIII 68.6


Eremburge (?)
Per The Henry Project:
     "Éremburge - Wife of Gervaise II de Château-du-Loir.
     "Éremburge appeared with her husband Gervaise in a charter of 1067×1068 [Cart. Château-du-Loir, 13-17], and with her husband and mother Mathilde in a charter of 1086×1095 [Cart. Château-du-Loir, 29]. She was deceased prior to a charter of 1095×1097, where Gervais appears with his second wife Gersende [Cart. Château-du-Loir, 32].
     "Date of Birth: Unknown.
     "Place of Birth: Unknown.
     "Date of Death: 1086×1097.
     "Place of Death: Unknown.
     "Father: Unknown.
     "Mother: Mathilde, living 1086×1095. Mathilde is named in a charter dated 1086×1095 of her son-in-law Gervaise and daughter Éremburge [Cart. Château-du-Loir, 29].
     "Spouse: m. bef. 1067×1068 Gervaise II, d. 1095 × ca. 1097, lord of Château-du-Loir.
Child:
     "FEMALE Mathilde de Château-du-Loir, m. Helias de La Flèche, count of Maine.
[OV x, 8 (v. 5, pp. 228-9)] Mathilde was already married to Helias by ca. 1095 [Cart. Château-du-Loir, 32], and could therefore not be by Gervaise's second wife Gersende.
Bibliography
** Cart. Château-du-Loir = Eugène Vallée, Cartulaire de Château-du-Loir (Archives Historiques du Maine 6, Le Mans, 1905).
** OV = Marjorie Chibnall, ed. & trans., The Ecclesiastical History of Orderic Vitalis, 6 vols. (Oxford, 1969-80).

Compiled by Stewart Baldwin.7 GAV25 EDV-26 GKJ-26.

Citations

  1. [S1490] Genealogics Website (oiginated by Leo van de Pas, continued by Ian Fettes), online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Eremburge: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00141489&tree=LEO. Hereinafter cited as Genealogics Website.
  2. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Mathilde: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00561410&tree=LEO
  3. [S2374] Find a Grave, online http://www.findagrave.com/, Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 22 November 2019), memorial page for Erembourge de Chateau du Loire (1040–1092), Find A Grave Memorial no. 157882095, citing Fontevraud Abbey, Fontevraud-l'Abbaye, Departement de Maine-et-Loire, Pays de la Loire, France ; Maintained by Memerizion (contributor 48072664), at: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/157882095/erembourge-de_chateau_du_loire. Hereinafter cited as Find a Grave.
  4. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Gervais: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00141488&tree=LEO
  5. [S1702] The Henry Project: The ancestors of king Henry II of England, An experiment in cooperative medieval genealogy on the internet, online http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/henry.htm, http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/prov/gerva000.htm. Hereinafter cited as The Henry Project.
  6. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Eremburge: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00141489&tree=LEO
  7. [S1702] The Henry Project, online http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/henry.htm, http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/prov/eremb001.htm
  8. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Matilda: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00029109&tree=LEO
  9. [S1702] The Henry Project, online http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/henry.htm, http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/prov/helia000.htm

Geoffroy V "Le Barbu" (?) Comte d'Anjou et de Gatinais1,2

M, #4834, b. circa 1040, d. between 1096 and 1097
FatherGeoffroy II/IV «Ferréol» (?) Cte de Château-Landon et de Beaumont-en-Gâtinais, Comte du Gâtinas1,2,3,4 b. c 1004, d. bt 30 Apr 1043 - 1 Apr 1046
MotherErmengarde/Blanche (?) Countess of Anjou1,2,5 b. c 1018, d. 18 Mar 1076
Last Edited3 Dec 2019
     Geoffroy V "Le Barbu" (?) Comte d'Anjou et de Gatinais was born circa 1040.1,2,6 He married Julienne de Langeais before 1060.1,2
Geoffroy V "Le Barbu" (?) Comte d'Anjou et de Gatinais died between 1096 and 1097.1,2,6
     Geoffroy V "Le Barbu" (?) Comte d'Anjou et de Gatinais
See Wikipedia article.6 He was Count of Anjou between 1060 and 1068.1,6

Family

Julienne de Langeais d. a 7 Aug 1067

Citations

  1. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, online http://genealogy.euweb.cz/index.html, unknown author (e-mail address), downloaded updated 15 May 2003, Anjou 2 page (The House of Anjou): http://genealogy.euweb.cz/anjou/anjou2.html#Is
  2. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Anjou-Gatinais.pdf, p. 5. Hereinafter cited as Racines et Histoire.
  3. [S1490] Genealogics Website (oiginated by Leo van de Pas, continued by Ian Fettes), online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Geoffrey Ferréol de Château-Landon: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020217&tree=LEO. Hereinafter cited as Genealogics Website.
  4. [S2203] Foundation for Medieval Genealogy (FMG): MEDIEVAL LANDS - A prosopography of medieval European noble and royal families, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/ANJOU,%20MAINE.htm#GeoffroyIIGatinaisdied1043B. Hereinafter cited as FMG Medieval Lands Website.
  5. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Ermengarde d'Anjou: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020216&tree=LEO
  6. [S1953] Wikipedia: The Free Encyclopedia, online http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geoffrey_III,_Count_of_Anjou. Hereinafter cited as Wikipedia.

Alberade (?) de Lorraine1,2,3

F, #4835, b. between 929 and 930, d. 15 March 973
FatherGiselbert II (?) Duke of Lorraine1,2,3 b. c 880, d. 2 Oct 939
MotherGerberga (?) von Sachsen1,4,2,5,3 b. bt 913 - 917, d. 5 May 984
ReferenceGAV27 EDV28
Last Edited25 Mar 2020
     Alberade (?) de Lorraine was born between 929 and 930 at Lorraine, France.6,7,8,3 She married Renaud/Ragenold/Ragnvald (?) comte de Roucy & Rheims, son of Rognvald (?), circa 945 at France.2,9,10,1,3
Alberade (?) de Lorraine died on 15 March 973 at France (now).11
Alberade (?) de Lorraine was buried after 15 March 973 at Saint Remi Badsilica, Reims, Departement de la Marne, Champagne-Ardenne, France (now),

; From Find A Grave:
     BIRTH     930, Netherlands
     DEATH     15 Mar 973 (aged 42–43), France
     Alberade was the daughter of Giselbert (Gilbert) Count of Hainault, Duke of Lorraine and Gerberga of Saxony, the granddaughter of Regnier I Count of Hainault and Hersent of France, Heinrich "The Fowler" King of the Germans and Mathilda of Ringleheim. She was a descendant of The Holy Roman Emperors Lothiar and Charles the Bald, and Charlemagne. She was born about 930 and died in 973.
     Albreda was the wife of Renauld de Roucy, Count of Roucy, Vicomte of Rheims and son of the Viking Rognvald. They were married circa 945 and had the following children:
* Gilbert De Roucy
* Ermetrude de Roucy, wife of Othon Guillaume de Bourgogne
* Unknown daughter, wife of Fromond of Sens
* Bruno, Bishop of Langres
     Family Members
     Parents
      Gilbert Of Lorraine
      Gerberga of Saxony 913–969
     Spouse
      Renaud de Roucy unknown–967
     Siblings
      Gerberge of Lorraine
     Half Siblings
      Charles Of Lower Lorraine
      Lothaire 941–986
      Mathilde de France 943–992
     Children
      Gilbert de Roucy unknown–1000
      Ermentrude De Roucy Bourgogne unknown–1005
     BURIAL     Saint Remi Basilica, Reims, Departement de la Marne, Champagne-Ardenne, France
     Maintained by: Anne Shurtleff Stevens
     Originally Created by: Jerry Ferren
     Added: 23 Mar 2011
     Find A Grave Memorial 67316059.11
     GAV-27 EDV-28 GKJ-29.

Reference: van de Pas cites:
     1. Caroli Magni Progenies, Neustadt an der Aisch, 1977 , Rösch, Siegfried, Reference: 156
     2. Europäische Stammtafeln, J.A. Stargardt Verlag, Marburg, Schwennicke, Detlev (Ed.), Reference: III/4 675A.2

Citations

  1. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, online http://genealogy.euweb.cz/index.html, unknown author (e-mail address), downloaded updated 15 May 2003, Brabant 1 page (Dukes of Brabant and Landgraves of Hesse): http://genealogy.euweb.cz/brabant/brabant1.html
  2. [S1490] Genealogics Website (oiginated by Leo van de Pas, continued by Ian Fettes), online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Alverade de Lorraine: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020518&tree=LEO. Hereinafter cited as Genealogics Website.
  3. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Brabant.pdf, p. 3. Hereinafter cited as Racines et Histoire.
  4. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Gerberga of Saxony: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020067&tree=LEO
  5. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Gerberga von Sachsen: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020067&tree=LEO
  6. [S602] Inc. Brøderbund Software, World Family Tree Vol. 14, Ed. 1, Family #2699 (n.p.: Release date: October 20, 1997, unknown publish date).
  7. [S619] Inc. Br²derbund Software, GEDCOM file imported on 27 Dec 1999 from World Family Tree Vol. 6, Ed. 1, Family #6-1556 (n.p.: Release date: August 22, 1996, unknown publish date).
  8. [S640] Inc. Brøderbund Software, World Family Tree Vol. L1, Ed. 1, Family #0021 (n.p.: Release date: October 30, 1998, unknown publish date).
  9. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Ragenold|Renaud: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020517&tree=LEO
  10. [S632] Frederick Lewis Weis, Ancestral Roots of Certain American Colonists Who Came to America before 1700: The Lineage of Alfred the Great, Charlemagne, Malcolm of Scotland, Robert the Strong, and Some of Their Descendants, 7th edition (n.p.: Genealogical Publishing Co., Inc.
    Baltimore, 1992, unknown publish date), line 151-20, p. 133. Hereinafter cited as Weis AR-7.
  11. [S2374] Find a Grave, online http://www.findagrave.com/, Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 07 October 2019), memorial page for Alberade de Roucy (930–15 Mar 973), Find A Grave Memorial no. 67316059, citing Saint Remi Basilica, Reims, Departement de la Marne, Champagne-Ardenne, France ; Maintained by Anne Shurtleff Stevens (contributor 46947920), at: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/67316059/alberade-de-roucy. Hereinafter cited as Find a Grave.
  12. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, Seigneurs de ROUCY & comtes de Reims, p. 3: http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Roucy.pdf
  13. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Ermentrud/Irmgard de Roucy: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020659&tree=LEO
  14. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Giselbert: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020519&tree=LEO

Giselbert II (?) Duke of Lorraine1,2

M, #4836, b. circa 880, d. 2 October 939
FatherReginar/Regnier I "Langhals" (?) graf im Hennegau, duc de Lotharingie1,2,3 b. c 850, d. bt 25 Oct 915 - 19 Jan 916
MotherAlberade (?) of Mons () b. c 870, d. 916; Doug McDonald wrote:

> Who were the parents of Giselbert, Duke of Lorraine,
> d. 939. His wife is lasted as Gerberga of Saxony.
>
> His father seems to be Reninar or Regnier of Lorraine.
>
> However, there are different mothers.
>
> Ancestral Roots has one Hersent, daughter of Charles the Bald.
> Leo van de Pas has one Alberade, parentage unknown. There are references
> to this 2002 here, mentioning a post by Settipani, which seems
> to be missing in the archives. There is a single item found
> on Google that seems to reference ES for this Alberade.
>
> Anybody have anything definitive?


Gislebert was the son of Reginar and Alberada - this is known from a charter of his wife Gerberga, on her return to Lorraine in February 968 (as the widow by then also of King Louis IV): "Gerberga...Francorum Regina...pro...remedio senioris nostri piæ memoriæ Gisleberti, suique parentum, patris scilicet et matris, Rageneri et Albradæ [_Recueil des historiens des Gaules et de la France_ volume IX p. 666, 'Reginarum diplomata' no. 5]

His father Reginar probably had another wife before marrying Alberada. The only direct evidence for this is an undated and possibly forged or at least miscopied charter, that could not be earlier than 887, for Saint-Dagobert de Stenay, in which a Count Reginar mentions his deceased wife Hersindis and apparently (I haven't seen the text) qualifies himself as successor to Emperor Charles (the Fat). This may have given rise to the idea that his wife had been a Carolingian heiress; but since Charles the Fat had no legitimate offspring and Charles the Bald had plenty, the paternity of Hersindis may have become speculatively (or rather, imaginatively) transferred to the latter. There is very little likelihood in my view that this could be correct, or worth discussing in Christian Settipani's book. However, there is no particular reason I can see to doubt that a lady of this name, of unknown family, was the first wife of Reginar. There would appear to be no value for a forger in the invention of such a wife merely to name her in passing.

Indirectly, it is probable that Reginar had another wife before Alberada: he was evidently born ca 850, occurring in an official capacity by 877, whereas his son Gislebert was apparently born as late as ca 895 - by my understanding of Richer's account he had only recently attained the age of 20 at the time of Reginar's funeral some time between August 915 and January 916, when the latter's powers were conferred on him by King Charles the Simple: "Peractisque exsequiis, Gisleberto eius filio, iam facto iuveni, paternum honorem, coram principibus qui confluxerant liberalissime accommodat", see _Historiarum libri IIII_, edited by Hartmut Hoffmann, MGH SS 38 (Hanover, 2000).

Most genealogists make Alberada the mother of all three known children of Reginar. Since Gislebert was her son it is likely that his younger brother was hers also, unless Reginar also had a subsequent wife (as has been suggested, though not at all convincingly to me - he is sometimes suggested as the father of Count Wigeric's wife Cunegundis, whose mother was King Louis II's daughter Ermentrudis).

However, I think a case can be made that the known daughter of Reginar could have been from the marriage to Hersindis. She (name unrecorded) married Berengar, ancestor of the counts of Namur. There was a notable lady named Hersindis in the following generation (living in October 949), the first wife of Eilbert of Florennes, who could well have been her daughter as conjectured by Léon Vanderkindere in _La formation territoriale des principautés belges au Moyen âge_(Brussels, 1902).

Peter Stewart1,4,2,3
ReferenceGAV28 EDV29
Last Edited10 Apr 2020
     Giselbert II (?) Duke of Lorraine was born circa 880 at Lorraine, France (now).5,6,2 He married Gerberga (?) von Sachsen, daughter of Heinrich I "der Vogelsteller/The Fowler/l'Oiseleur" (?) Emperor of Germany, Duke of Saxony, Brunswick and Zelle and Queen MechtildeMatilda of Oldenburg (?) Countess von Ringelheim, between 928 and 929; Leo van de Pas says m. 928.7,6,1,8,9,10,2
Giselbert II (?) Duke of Lorraine died on 2 October 939 at Rhine River, Andernach, andkreis Mayen-Koblenz, Rheinland-Pfalz, Germany (now); drowned 939 attempting to ford the Rhine in armour after his defeat nr Andernach while in rebellion against his bro-in-law OTTO THE GREAT (later HOLY ROMAN EMPEROR.)7,6,1,2,3,5
     Giselbert II (?) Duke of Lorraine
GISELBERT, DUKE OF LORRAINE; b c 890; m 929 the Saxon princess Gerberga (m 2nd LOUIS IV OF FRANCE), dau of HENRY (THE FOWLER), KING OF THE EAST FRANKS, and was drowned 939 attempting to ford the Rhine in armour after his defeat nr Andernach while in rebellion against his bro-in-law OTTO THE GREAT (later HOLY ROMAN EMPEROR).6 He was per Racines et Histoire: "abbé de Stablo (915-925) rebelle à Charles III «Le Simple» (918), abbé laïc d’Echternach (924-939), abbé de Saint-Maximin de Trier (Trêves, 925-934), créé duc (928) par Heinrich 1er, roi de Germanie qui l’investit du duché de Lotharingie (924-939.)2"

Giselbert II (?) Duke of Lorraine
From Find A Grave: "Gilbert (Giselbert) was born abt. 890 to Reginar, Duke of Lorraine (Lotharingia) and his wife, Hersinda. He became duke of Lorraine sometime after Reginar's death in 915, possibly as late as 928. In 925, he pledged fealty to King Henry the Fowler (Heinrich I) of Germany and married his daughter, Gerberga (Gerberge) of Saxony abt. 929/930. They had four children, Henry, Alberade, Hedewige and Gerberge. When Henry died in 936, Gilbert rebelled against his successor, Otto I, and aligned with Louis IV of France. He was defeated by Otto's forces at the Battle of Andernach in 939. Made prisoner, he escaped but drowned in the Rhine on Oct. 2, 939. His wife married Louis IV a few months later. [Information extracted from Wikipedia]"5 GAV-28 EDV-29 GKJ-30. He was Duke of Lotharingia (Lorraine) between 924 and 939.1,3

Family

Gerberga (?) von Sachsen b. bt 913 - 917, d. 5 May 984
Children

Citations

  1. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, online http://genealogy.euweb.cz/index.html, unknown author (e-mail address), downloaded updated 15 May 2003, Brabant 1 page (Dukes of Brabant and Landgraves of Hesse): http://genealogy.euweb.cz/brabant/brabant1.html
  2. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Brabant.pdf, p. 2. Hereinafter cited as Racines et Histoire.
  3. [S1490] Genealogics Website (oiginated by Leo van de Pas, continued by Ian Fettes), online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Giselbert: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020488&tree=LEO. Hereinafter cited as Genealogics Website.
  4. [S1823] Peter Stewart, "Stewart email #1 3 Nov 2004 "Re: Giselbert Duke of Lorraine parentage"," e-mail message from e-mail address (unknown address) to e-mail address, 3 Nov 2004. Hereinafter cited as "Stewart email #1 3 Nov 2004."
  5. [S2374] Find a Grave, online http://www.findagrave.com/, Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 06 October 2019), memorial page for Gilbert Of Lorraine (unknown–unknown), Find A Grave Memorial no. 134022736, ; Maintained by Darrell and Joan Mansur (contributor 48248313) Body lost or destroyed, who reports a Drowned in the Rhine, at: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/134022736/gilbert-of-lorraine. Hereinafter cited as Find a Grave.
  6. [S1396] Burke's Peerage & Gentry Web Site, online http://www.burkes-peerage.net/sites/peerageandgentry/sitepages/home.asp, Milford Haven Family Page. Hereinafter cited as Burke's Peerage & Gentry Web Site.
  7. [S632] Frederick Lewis Weis, Ancestral Roots of Certain American Colonists Who Came to America before 1700: The Lineage of Alfred the Great, Charlemagne, Malcolm of Scotland, Robert the Strong, and Some of Their Descendants, 7th edition (n.p.: Genealogical Publishing Co., Inc.
    Baltimore, 1992, unknown publish date), line 151-18, p. 133. Hereinafter cited as Weis AR-7.
  8. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, updated 15 May 2003, Liudolfer page (Liudolfing): http://genealogy.euweb.cz/german/liudolfer.html
  9. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Gerberga of Saxony: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020067&tree=LEO
  10. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Gerberga von Sachsen: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020067&tree=LEO
  11. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Alverade de Lorraine: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020518&tree=LEO
  12. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Brabant.pdf, p. 3.
  13. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Gerberga de Lorraine: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020493&tree=LEO
  14. [S2203] Foundation for Medieval Genealogy (FMG): MEDIEVAL LANDS - A prosopography of medieval European noble and royal families, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/LOTHARINGIAN%20(LOWER)%20NOBILITY.htm#Gerbergadied978. Hereinafter cited as FMG Medieval Lands Website.
  15. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, Comtes de Hainaut, Hennegau, p. 3: http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Hainaut.pdf

Adélaïde/Adelais (?)1,2

F, #4837, d. after 999
ReferenceGAV27 EDV28
Last Edited26 Apr 2020
     Adélaïde/Adelais (?) married Lambert (?) Cte de Châlons, son of Robert (?) Vicomte d'Autun and Ingeltrude (?), on 7 December 954;
His 2nd wife; her 1st husband.1,3,4,5,2
Adélaïde/Adelais (?) was buried after 6 March 974 at Saint Aubin Abbey, Angers, Departement de Maine-et-Loire, Pays de la Loire, France (now),

; From Find A Grave:
     BIRTH     unknown, Caen, Departement du Calvados, Basse-Normandie, France
     DEATH     unknown, France
     Adele of Meaux born about 950 and died 980. She was also known as "Adele of Vermandois". She was a daughter of Robert of Vermandois and Adelaide-Werra de Chalon. She married twice, first to Lambert, Count of Chalon, and then to Geoffrey I of Anjou, and had three children with each.
     With Lambert of Chalon:
** Hugh I of Autun, Bishop of Auxerre (-1039)
** Mahaut of Autun, Count of Chalon (-1019)
** Aelis of Chalon, who married Guido I of Macon
     With Geoffrey I of Anjou:
** Fulk III "the Black" b: ABT 0970
** Ermengarde of Anjou
** Gerberge of Anjou b: ABT 0982 in Anjou
     Family Members
     Parents
          Robert de Vermandois 910–968
          Adelaide Werra de Bourgogne 920–967
     Spouses
          Lambert I d'Autun de Chalon 924–978
          Geoffroy I de Anjou unknown–987
     Children
          Fulk III Anjou unknown–1040
          Ermengarde D'Anjou Bretagne De Rennes 958–1022
     BURIAL     Saint Aubin Abbey, Angers, Departement de Maine-et-Loire, Pays de la Loire, France
     Created by: Kat
     Added: 23 Dec 2011
     Find A Grave Memorial 82326968.6 She married Geoffroi I "Grisegonelle" (?) Comte d'Anjou, son of Foulques II "le Bon" (?) Comte d'Anjou and Gerberge (?) d'Arles, du Maine, in March 979 at France;
His 2nd wife.7,8,9,1,2
Adélaïde/Adelais (?) died after 999.1
     GAV-27 EDV-28 GKJ-28.

Adélaïde/Adelais (?)
     Per Stewart email [2004]: "This Countess Adela of Anjou died (perhaps in childbirth) in 974 after giving a charter dated 6 March on her death-bed, "ego Adela...in extremis circumvallantibus angustiis constituta", _Cartulaire de l'abbaye de Saint-Aubin d'Angers_, edited by A Bertrand de Brousillon, 3 vols (Angers, 1896-1903) I no 3, pp 8...10."10

Adélaïde/Adelais (?)
Per The Henry Project: Adélaïde
     "Wife of Lambert, count of Chalon, and Geoffroy Grisegonelle, count of Anjou.
     "Adélaïde appears with her husband count Lambert of Chalon and her son Hugues in a number of sources ["Clarissimus comes domnus Lambertus... S. Adalaidis, uxoris ejus, et Hugonis, filii ejus." Cart. Paray-le-Monial, 82-3 (#165); "Facit autem hanc donationem jamdictus præsul Hugo Deo devotus, primum pro amore Dei, inde pro anima patris sui Lanberti ac matris suæ Adeleydis..." Cart. Paray-le-Monial, 113 (#213); "Hugo Cabilonensis, ex patre Lamberto, comitum venerabilissimo, et matre Adelaide generosissima..." Gesta pontificum Autissiodorensium, c. 49, Bib. Hist. Yonne, 1: 386]. The chronology of Adélaïde's marriages is difficult to determine, because of contradictions in the sources. She appears with her first husband Lambert in the 28th year of Lothair, which would be between 12 November 981 and 11 November 982 if dated in the usual way, but this contradicts the usual date of 978 given for Lambert's death ["Ego Lanbertus comes atque uxor mea Adeleydis ... anno XXVIII Hlotharii regis" Cart. Cluny 2: 755 (#1444bis)]. She appears (without a husband) with her son Hugues in the 26th year of Lothair ["... S. Adalaidis, comitissæ humilis, et Hugonis, filii ejus. ... pridie kalendas decembris, die martis, anno XXVI regnante Lothario rege." Cart. Cluny, 2: 587 (#1537)]. Adélaïde appears with her second husband Geoffroy in the 30th year of Lothair ["... S. Gauzfredi, comitis. S. Adaleidis, comitissa. ..., die XVIII mensis octobris, regnante Hlothario rege anno XXX" Cart. Cluny 2: 724 (#1701)]. She appears again with Geoffroy in the "34th year" of Lothair ["... ego Gausfredus, comes, atque uxor mea Adeleidis, atque Hugo, filius Lanberti comitis ... Signum Gausfredi, comitis, et uxor ejus Adaleidis et Hugonis, filii ejus... Data mense martio, anno XXXIIII Hlotharii regis." Cart. Cluny 2: 528-9 (#1474); note that Lothair reigned for less than 32 years]. The chronological problems of these charters are discussed on Lambert's page.
     "Date of birth: Unknown.
     "Place of birth: Unknown.
     "Date of death: After 999. She was still living in 999, because she signed a charter in which her son Hugues appears as bishop ["S. Hugonis comitis et episcopi. S. Adelaidis com[itissæ]. S. Mauricii." Cart. Paray-le-Monial, 6 (#5)]
     "Place of death: Unknown.
     "Father: Unknown.
     "Mother: Unknown.
     "There have been numerous conjectures regarding her parentage. See the Commentary section.
Spouses:
     "(1) Lambert, d. 22 February, 977×985, probably 978, count of Chalon.
     "(2) Geoffroy I Grisegonelle, d. 21 July 987, count of Anjou.
Children:
(by Lambert)
     "MALE Hugues, d. 4 November 1039, count of Chalon, prob. 978-1039; bishop of Auxerre, 999-1039.
     "FEMALE Mathilde, d. before 1019, m. Geoffroy de Semur.
See the page of Lambert.

(by Geoffroy)
     "MALE Maurice, d. in or before 1038.
See the page of Geoffroy I Grisegonelle.

Commentary
Adélaïde's second marriage to count Geoffroy
     "It is well documented that after the death of Lambert, Adélaïde married a count named Geoffroy. This is proven quite clearly in a charter of her second husband Geoffroy from Cluny ["... ego Gausfredus, comes, atque uxor mea Adeleidis, atque Hugo, filius Lanberti comitis ... Signum Gausfredi, comitis, et uxor ejus Adaleidis et Hugonis, filii ejus... Data mense martio, anno XXXIIII Hlotharii regis." Cart. Cluny 2: 528-9 (#1474)] and in a charter of her grandson count Thibaud of Chalon from Saint-Marcel-lès-Chalon ["Ego in Dei nomine Tetbaldus comes Cabilonensium ... quod nobilissimus comes Gaufredus, qui post mortem prestantissimi et christianissimi comitis, avii mei Lamberti, accepit ejus conjugem, aviam meam, Adheleydam comitissam..." Cart. S.-Marcel-lès-Chalon, 11 (#6)]. It is also clear that Adélaïde was the mother of a son named Maurice, as established by several charters ["Clarissimus et strenuissimus Cabilonensium comes, domnus Hugo, et mater ejus nomine Adeleidis, et domnus Mauricius, frater ejus... in beneficio comite Lamberto et uxore ejus Adeleide et filio eorum Hugone." Cart. Paray-le-Monial, 90 (#180); "Domnus Hugo comes atque mater sua, nomine Adeleidis... Testes sunt domnus Hugo comes. S. Adeleidis, matris suae. S. Mauritii, filii ejus." Cart. Paray-le-Monial, 97-8 (#193); "S. Hugonis comitis. S. Mauricii comitis, fratris ejus. S. Adeleydis, matris eorum, comitisse." Cart. Cluny 3: 50 (#1794)]. However, there is no unambiguous evidence which would either clearly identify this Geoffroy or tell us whether Maurice was Adélaïde's son by her first husband Lambert or her second husband Geoffroy.
     "The possibility that Maurice was by Adélaïde's second husband can then be matched with what seems like more than a coincidence, for count Geoffroy Grisegonelle of Anjou (d. 987) was the father of a son Maurice, mentioned as a brother of Geoffroy's son count Foulques "Nerra" in a charter of 1003 [Cart. S.-Aubin 1: 157-8]. Thus, the main issue here is two identifications, that is, the possible identification of Geoffroy Grisegonelle as the count Geoffroy who was Adélaïde's second husband, and the possible identification of Adélaïde's son Maurice with the son of Geoffroy Grisegonelle of the same name. It is easily seen that the truth of either one of these identifications would virtually clinch the other one, so we can easily assume that the two identifications are either both true or both false. The identifications are widely accepted in the histories of Anjou [e.g., Mabille (1871); Halphen (1906); Bachrach (1985)]. In 1986, Henri de Chizelle argued against these identifications, identifying the second husband of Adélaïde as a certain Geoffroy de Semur [Chizelle (1986)]. In a long paper on the maternal ancestry of Otte-Guillaume of Burgundy (probably a grandson of Lambert) in 1994, Christian Settipani argued in favor of the identifications, followed by a response by Chizelle in 1996. Points which have been made on each side include the following.
For the identifications:
** The name Maurice is relatively uncommon.
** Maurice of Anjou is not mentioned in the 974 charter of Adèle, wife of Geoffroy Grisegonelle which mentions her two known sons by Geoffroy [Cart. S.-Aubin 1: 7-10], suggesting that Maurice was not a son of Adèle.
** Since the second husband of Adélaïde is called "count" Geoffroy, Geoffroy of Anjou is an obvious candidate. In particular, the Geoffroy of Semur offered as an alternative by Henri de Chizelle is known only from late local histories, and his attempts to identify count Geoffroy with a certain Josserand are unconvincing [Chizelle (1996), 82-3].
** The count Geoffroy who was the second husband of Adélaïde does not appear in the records after the reign of Lothaire (d. 986), which would be consistent with his identification of Geoffroy Grisegonelle (d. 987).
** The Gesta pontificum Autissiodorensium states that Hugues had no "germanus frater" to represent his affairs ["Huic non pervenerat afinitate germanus frater, qui videlicet hereditario jure res paternas regere potuisset...", Gesta pontificum Autissiodorensium, c. 49, Bib. Hist. Yonne, 1: 387]. In addition, Rodulfus Glaber states that Hugues was Lambert's only son ["Fuit enim idem Hugo episcopus Autissioderi, regensque comitatum patris ex imperio regis, quoniam praeter eum pater non habuit sobolem sexus masculini", Rodulfus Glaber III, ii, 6, p. 57]. This suggests that Maurice, brother of count/bishop Hugues, was a son of Adélaïde by her second marriage with a count Geoffroy. Thus, two independent sources suggest that Hugues was the only son of Lambert. If Lambert were indeed a son of Adélaïde by her second marriage, this would make a strong case for the identification, for otherwise the existence of two father son pairs named count Geoffroy and Maurice would have to be explained away as a striking coincidence.
Against the identifications:
The identifications are not directly attested. The count Geoffroy who married Adélaïde is not otherwise identified in the records, and no second marriage for Geoffroy Grisegonelle is directly attested. In addition, the title of "count" for Adélaïde's second husband does not necessarily mean that he held that title before his marriage to Adélaïde.
** One copy of one of the Cluny charters has Hugues mention his brother Maurice and our father Lambert, evidently making Maurice a son of Lambert. ["Quapropter, inquit, ut Deum propicium habere possim, tam ego Hugo comes, quam mater Adelaydis, et frater meus Mauritius et tam pro ablutione pii patris [nostri] Lanberti", Cart. Cluny 3: 49 (#1794); Chizelle (1986), 54]. However, this argument is weakened by the fact that the word nostri appears in only one of the two copies on which the published charter is based, and by the possibility that Hugues was using the "royal we" in the use of that word.
** A charter of count-bishop Hugues dated 999 mentions his brothers and sisters as both in the plural ["Facit autem hanc donacionem jamdictus praesul Hugo Deo devotus, primum pro amore Dei, inde pro anima patris sui Lanberti, ac matris suae Adeleydis, ac gloriosi Rodberti regis atque Aeynrici ducis, necnon pro animabus fratrum ac sororum, nepotumque ac omnium utriusque sexus propinquorum... sicuti olim a Gausfredo comite, matris ejusdem praesulis conjuge... Signum Hugonis episcopi, qui hanc donationem fieri et firmare rogavit. Signum Aynrici ducis. Signum Ottonis comitis. Signum Widonis comitis. Signum Mauricii comitis. ... Data mense maio, indictione duodecima, anno Incarnationis dominicae DCCCCmo.XCo.VIIIIo, Rodberto rege, anno quarto regni ejus." Cart. Paray-le-Monial, 111-114 (#213); also in Cart. Cluny 3: 562-6 (#2484)]. However, this need not refer to living brothers and sisters.
** The reference of Maurice, brother of Hugues, as a count in about 988 ["S. Hugonis comitis. S. Mauricii comitis, fratris ejus. S. Adeleydis, matris eorum, comitisse." Cart. Cluny 3: 50 (#1794)] would suggest that he was more than just a boy at the time, as any son of Adélaïde by her second marriage would have to be.
** The most straightforward interpretation of the evidence involving the parentage of Gerberge, successively wife of king Adalberto of Italy and duke Eudes-Henri of Burgundy, and mother of Otte-Guillaume, count of Burgundy, would make her a full sister (germana) of Hugues, count of Chalon and bishop of Auxerre, and thus a daughter of Lambert and Adélaïde. This in turn would lead to a serious chronological problem in the birth of Adélaïde's children, for Gerberge's date of birth can be placed as late as say 947 only with difficulty. If Maurice was a son of Adélaïde's second marriage to count Geoffroy, then he would have been born in 979 or later. An interval of 32 years between the births of two children of the same woman is at the very edge of the range of believability (if, say, the elder child were born when the woman was 15 and the younger one when she was 47). These matters are discussed in much more detail on Gerberge's page.
     "Of all of the arguments against the identifications, the only serious problem is the chronological one. When I first wrote about this problem, in an earlier version of the page for Geoffroy Grisegonelle, I left the matter unsettled. Now that I have examined the evidence for Gerberge's parentage in detail, I believe that the identifications are correct. The most probable solution for the chronological problem is that Gerberge was a daughter of Lambert by an earlier marriage. The solution proposed by Chizelle, which would take care of the chronological problem by rejecting the identifications and making Maurice a son of Lambert (thus allowing an earlier birthdate), is much less likely.
Supposed child (chronologically improbable): Gerberge, more probably a daughter of Lambert, count of Chalon, by an earlier marriage. There are two problems that have led to contradictory opinions about Gerberge's parentage. One is the existence of two contradictory sources, which is discussed in detail on Gerberge's page. The other problem involves the chronology of Adélaïde's children, as is discussed above in the comments about her second marriage.
Two Adélaïdes and an Adèle - a maze of confusion
     "The modern secondary literature has a great deal of confusion surrounding the origin and identity of Adélaïde, whom we shall here call "of Chalon" for lack of a better name, to distinguish her from her namesakes. She has been confused with two other women, mother and daughter, who together with Adélaïde of Chalon make up the "two Adélaïdes and an Adèle" mentioned in the title of this section. The other two women are:
** Adélaïde, also known as Werra, wife of count Robert of Troyes.
** Her daughter Adèle, first wife of Geoffroy Grisegonelle.
     "Several things have contributed to this confusion. The similarity in the women's names has led to problems. This has been even more the case in some French works which have given the names of all three women in the form "Aélis". The fact that two of the women were married to Geoffroy Grisegonelle of Anjou has certainly aided the confusion. The commonly conjectured (but doubtful) connection of Adélaïde of Chalon as a daughter or granddaughter of Giselbert of Burgundy can be contrasted to Adélaïde/Werra's genuine status as Giselbert's daughter.
     "The supposed connection of Adélaïde of Chalon to the family of Giselbert is based on the fact that her first husband Lambert is indicated as the first count of Chalon (apparently, of his family), and Giselbert was previously count of Chalon ["... nobilissimus strenuissimusque Lambertus, filius Rotberti vicecomitis, Ingeltrude matre ortus, obtinuit comitatum Cabilonensem primus, assentante rege primoribusque Francie..." Cart. Paray-le-Monial, 2 (#2)]. From this, it has been claimed that Lambert's claim to Chalon came through his wife Adélaïde, and that Adélaïde was therefore closely related to Giselbert. As is discussed in more detail on Giselbert's page, there is no direct evidence to support this claim. Although the parentage of Adélaïde of Chalon remains unknown, it is improbable that her relationship to Giselbert, if any, was that of daughter or granddaughter.
     "Nevertheless, since Adélaïde/Werra and Adèle were (respectively) a daughter and granddaughter of Giselbert, the incorrect attempts to place Adélaïde of Chalon as a daughter or granddaughter of Giselbert have resulted in several variations in which Adélaïde of Chalon is a sister of either Adélaïde/Werra or Adèle or is identified with one of them. For example, Vajay made Adélaïde of Chalon a niece of Adèle [Vajay (1962), 159], while Chizelle made Adèle a niece of Adélaïde of Chalon [Chizelle (1986), 69], and both of them made things even more confusing by calling both women Aélis, a French form often treated as an equivalent of both Adélaïde and Adèle. Given this, it is not surprising that many modern sources have been confused about the three women. Among the various false scenarios which have appeared, we indicate four versions below.
Scenario 1:
     "Falsely attributed father: Giselbert, d. 8 April 956, duke of Burgundy.
     "Falsely attributed mother: Ermengarde.
     "Falsely attributed sister: Adélaïde alias Werra, m. Robert, count of Troyes.
[Lot (1891), 323-6; Poupardin (1907), 220, 417; Chizelle (1986), 69] In addition to the lack of any direct evidence for such an affiliation, we have the problem that it would give us two sisters with the same name, an unlikely occurrence which should not be accepted without better evidence. See the page of Giselbert for further discussion.
Scenario 2:
False identification: Adélaïde alias Werra, m. Robert, count of Troyes.
Falsely attributed children:
MALE Heribert "juvenus", d. 28 January 995 or 996, count of Meaux and Troyes, 980×4-995×6.
FEMALE Adèle, living 6 March 974, m. ca. 965, Geoffroy I Grisegonelle, d. 987, count of Anjou.

[ES 3.1: 49, 116] This scenario is a further variation of Scenario 1, in which the two Adélaïdes are identified. It would have the very improbable result of making the second wife of Geoffroy Grisegonelle the mother of his first wife.
Scenario 3:
Falsely attributed grandfather: Giselbert, d. 8 April 956, duke of Burgundy.
Falsely attributed father: Robert, count of Troyes.
Falsely attributed mother: Adélaïde alias Werra, daughter of Giselbert, duke of Burgundy.
[Arbois de Jubainville (1859-66), 1: 140, 142; Kalckstein (1877), 302 & n. 2; Vajay (1962), 159] This scenario was refuted by Lot [Lot (1891), 323-6]. It is also improbable that the second wife of Geoffroy Grisegonelle was a sister of his first wife.
Scenario 4:
False identification: Adèle, first wife of Geoffroy I Grisegonelle, and daughter of Robert, count of Troyes.
Falsely attributed children:
MALE Foulques III "Nerra", d. 1040, count of Anjou.
MALE Geoffroy.
MALE Bouchard (Barbatus), supposed father of Bouchard de Montmorency.
FEMALE Adélaïde, mother of queen Constance.
     "One example of this impossible identification comes from a fabricated genealogy which was published with the cartulary of Trinité de Vendôme ["Anno inaugurationis Hugonis regis, obiit Godefridus comes Andegavorum dictus Grisagonella, filius Fulconis comitis dicti Boni et Gerbergæ comitissæ, et requiescit cum Adella uxore sua, relicta Lamberti comitis, in ecclesia Sancti-Martini. Godefridus comes et Adela habuerunt quatuor filios et duas filias: Fulconem comitem dictum Nigram, qui patri successit, Gaufridum de Montebasonis patrem Gaufridi, Mauricium et Burchardum Barbatum, qui fuit pater Burchardi de Montemaurenciaco, Gelduini archipresulis et Alberici comitis, et Adelasiam uxorem Willelmi comitis quæ fuit mater Constantiæ reginæ." Cart. Trinité de Vendôme, 1: 10-11 (#3)]. Of the supposed children, Foulques and Geoffroy were children of Geoffroy I Grisegonelle by his first wife Adèle de Troyes (see Geoffroy's page), Bouchard is part of a late attempt to fabricate an origin for the house of Montmorency, and Constance's mother Adélaïde was a sister of Geoffroy (see the page of Foulques II). Since Adèle was married to Geoffroy before 974, when Lambert was still alive, and Adélaïde only married Geoffroy after the death of Lambert, this identification is impossible.
Other possibilities and conjectures
Possible relative: Constance, m. Robert II, king of France (relative of son Hugues). Rodulfus Glaber states that Constance was related to Hugues, count of Chalon and bishop of Auxerre ["Accepit autem supradictus rex illius cognatam nomine et animo Constantiam, inclitam reginam, filiam videlicet prioris Willelmi Aquitaniæ ducis, ex qua etiam suscepit filios quattuor et filias duas." Rodulfus Glaber, iii, 7 (pp. 57-8)]. Since Constance was not, as stated in this passage, a daughter of Guillaume of Aquitaine, but was a daughter of Guillaume I of Provence, that explains the conjectures which appear in the next item.
Prou, Duchesne:
Supposed father or brother: Guillaume I, count of Arles (Provence).
     "In his edition of Rodulfus Glaber's work, Prou stated that Adélaïde was a sister of Constance, wife of king Robert II [Rodulfus Glaber, 43, n. 1]. Duchesne stated that she was a sister of Guillaume I [Duchesne (1619), 387]. While neither stated an explicit reason, both are undoubtedly based on the statement of Rodulfus Glaber mentioned in the previous item. Both seem to be assuming that cognata refers to a very close relative, which need not be the case. Chronologically, Prou's conjecture appears to ignore the fact that Constance was probably younger than Adélaïde's children.
Sackur:
Supposed father (improbable): Aubry I, count of Mâcon.
Supposed identification (improbable): Attala, daughter of Aubry I.
     "This suggestion, by Ernst Sackur [Sackur (1892-4), 2: 469-471], is based on a charter of count Liétaud (son of Aubry I) from February 944, which mentioned a certain Lambert, Liétaud's consanguineus, gave land to Liétaud, and that the same land was later regranted to Liétaud by his sister Attala ["ego Leotaldus et uxor mea Berta... hoc est mansus indominicatus cum æcclesia Beati Martini, quem mihi Lanbertus, consanguineus meus, dedit, et soror mea Attala michi postea reddidit, situs in pago Cabillonense, in villa Flagiaco...", Cart. Cluny, 1: 609-610 (#655)]. Given that Adélaïde gave birth to her son Maurice in 979 or later, it is unlikely that she was married as early as 944. See the pages of Lambert and Gerberge for further discussion.
Settipani:
Conjectured father (improbable): Hugues, d. after 936, count in Burgundy, son of Garnier, viscount of Sens.
Conjectured mother (improbable): Willa, d. after 967, conjectured daughter of Louis, son of Rhodolphe I, king of Burgundy.
     "This uses the names of Adélaïde's children and grandchildren as an onomastic starting point. Since Settipani regards Adélaïde as the mother of Gerberge, the names Gerberge, Otton, and Guillaume are included on the list of names which are regarded as the onomastic clues to Adélaïde's origin [Settipani (1994), 44-53]. Given that Adélaïde's status as Gerberge's mother is questionable, this conjecture is based on underlying assumptions which are doubtful at best.
Bouchard:
Conjectured ancestor: Louis "the Blind", d. after 927, king of Provence and Italy, emperor.
Conjectured ancestor: Adélaïde, second wife of Louis.
     "This onomastically based conjecture also hypothesizes a close relation to another Adélaïde, the wife of Hugues Capet [Bouchard (2001), 152-3].
See also Lambert's page for certain additional children who have been attributed to Lambert and Adélaïde.
Bibliography
** Arbois de Jubainville (1859-66) = H. d'Arbois de Jubainville, Histoire des ducs et des comtes de Champagne, 6 vols. (Paris, 1859-1866).
** Bachrach (1985) = Bernard S. Bachrach, "Geoffrey Greymantle, count of the Angevins, 960-987: a study in French politics", Studies in Medieval and Renaissance History 17 (n.s. 7, 1985): 3-65.
** Bib. Hist. Yonne = Louis-Maximilien Duru, ed., Bibliothèque historique de l'Yonne, 2 vols., (Auxerre & Paris, 1850-63).
** Bouchard (1987) = Constance Brittain Bouchard, Sword, Miter, and Cloister - Nobility and the church in Burgundy, 980-1198 (Cornell University Press, 1987).
** Bouchard (2001) = Constance Brittain Bouchard, "Those of my Blood" Constructing Noble Families in Medieval Francia (Philadelphia, 2001).
** Cart. Cluny = A. Bernard & A. Bruel, Recueil des chartes de l'abbaye de Cluny, 6 vols., (Paris, 1876-1903).
** Cart. Paray-le-Monial = Ulysse Chevalier, ed., Cartulaire de Paray-le-Monial (Montbéliard, 1891).
** Cart. S.-Aubin = Bertrand de Broussillon, Cartulaire de l'abbaye de Saint-Aubin d'Angers, 3 vols. (Angers, 1903).
** Cart. S.-Marcel-lès-Chalon = Paul Canat de Chizy, ed., Cartulaire du prieuré de Saint-Marcel-lès-Chalon (Chalon-sur-Saône, 1894).
** Cart. Trinité de Vendôme = Charles Métais, Cartulaire de l'abbaye cardinale de la Trinité de Vendôme, 2 vols. (Paris, 1893).
** Chizelle (1986) = Henri de Chizelle, "Aperçu sur le comté de Chalon-sur-Saône au Xe siècle: à propos de la comtesse Aélis", Annales de Bourgogne 58 (1986): 45-70.
** Chizelle (1996) = Henri de Chizelle, "Notes complémentaires concernant Aélis (Adèlais), comtesse de Chalon", Annales de Bourgogne 68 (1996): 79-83.
** Duchesne (1619) = André Duchesne (du Chesne), Histoire des roys, ducs, et comtes de Bourgogne et d'Arles (Paris, 1619).
** ES = Detlev Schwennicke, Europäische Stammtafeln (neue Folge), (Marburg, 1980-present).
** Halphen (1906) = Louis Halphen, Le comté d'Anjou au XIe siècle (Paris, 1906).
** Kalckstein (1877) = Carl von Kalckstein, Geschichte des französischen Königthums unter den ersten Capetingern (Leipzig, 1877).
** Lot (1891) = Ferdinand Lot, Les derniers Carolingiens (Paris, 1891).
** Mabille (1871) = Émile Mabille, Introduction au Chroniques des Comtes d'Anjou (Société de l'Histoire de France, vol. 155, Paris, 1871).
** Poupardin (1907) = René Poupardin, Le royaume de Bourgogne (888-1038) - Étude sur les origines du royaume d'Arles (Paris, 1907).
** Rodulfus Glaber = Maurice Prou, ed., Raoul Glaber - les cinq livres de ses histoires (900-1044) (Paris, 1886).
** Sackur (1892-4) = Ernst Sackur, Die Cluniacenser in ihrer kirchlichen und allgemeingeschichtlichen Wirksamkeit bis zur Mitte des elften Jahrhunderts, 2 vols. in 1 (Halle an der Saale, 1892-4).
** Settipani (1994) = Christian Settipani, "Les origines maternelles du comte de Bourgogne Otte-Guillaume", Annales de Bourgogne 66 (1994), 5-63.
Compiled by Stewart Baldwin
     "First uploaded 24 April 2008.
     "Minor revision uploaded 26 July 2008 (added Bouchard conjecture on Adélaïde's origin)."1

Adélaïde/Adelais (?)
Per Med Lands (Ref #1):
     "m secondly (Mar 979) as her second husband, ADELAIS, widow of LAMBERT Comte de Chalon, daughter of --- (-after 18 Oct 984). "Lanbertus comes [et]…Adeleydis uxor mea" made a joint donation of "capellam beati Martini in villa Vigoseto" to Cluny by charter dated 978[94]. "Gausfredus comes [et]…Adeleidis uxor mea" jointly donated land in "pago Cabilonensi" by charter dated Mar 979, her first marriage being deduced from "Hugo filius Lanberti comitis" acting jointly with them and signing "Hugonis filii eius" directly after "Adeleidis" in the subscriptions[95]. "Gauzfredi comitis, Adaleidis comitissa" subscribed a charter dated 18 Oct 984[96]. The origin of Adelais has been the subject of much speculation. Settipani has suggested that she was the daughter of Hugues Comte en Bourgogne & his wife Willa von Thurgau[97]. Chaume suggested that she was the daughter or granddaughter of Charles Constantin Comte de Vienne[98]. Bouchard sets out several different theories concerning Adelais's origin, with the aim mainly of explaining Lambert's succession to the county of Chalon by inheritance through his wife. However, none appears to be based on any primary source and the author concludes that she prefers "to leave Adelaide's origins unknown"[99]. An earlier theory was that Adelais was the sister of "Wera" Ctss de Meaux[100], which would mean that she was Adelais, daughter of Giselbert Duke of Burgundy, Comte de Chalon-sur-Saône et de Troyes & his wife Ermengarde [of Burgundy]. Duchesne suggested that Adelais Ctss de Chalon was the daughter of Robert Comte de Meaux et de Troyes[101], although this would mean that the two wives of Geoffroy I Comte d'Anjou were sisters, no mention of which has been found in contemporary sources. Yet another suggestion is that Adelais Ctss de Chalon was the same person as Wera-Adelais Ctss de Meaux. However, this is even more unlikely chronologically considering the estimated birth date of Wera-Adelais and the fact that Adelais de Chalon gave birth to at least one child by her second husband after their marriage in 979. It would also mean that Comte Geoffroy married, as his second wife, his first wife's mother which is unlikely to have been accepted by the church. Finally, in 1619, Duchesne suggested that Adelais was the sister of Guillaume I Comte d'Arles[102].
Comte Geoffroy I & his second wife had one child:
5. MAURICE d'Anjou ([980]-1012, bur Châteauneuf, église Saint-Martin)."
Med Lands cites:
[94] Cluny, Tome II, 1444 bis, p. 755.
[95] Cluny Tome II, 1474, p. 528.
[96] Cluny Tome II, 1701, p. 723.
[97] Settipani 'Les origines maternelles d'Otte-Guillaume' (1994), pp 48-49.
[98] Bouchard (1987), p. 309, citing Chaume, M. (1925-1931) Les origines du duché de Bourgogne 2 Vols. reprint 1977 (Dijon), Vol. 1, p. 447 n. 2.
[99] Bouchard (1987), p. 309.
[100] Lot (1891), pp. 323-34, and Poupardin (1907), pp. 206 and 417, cited in Bouchard (1987), p. 309.
[101] Duchesne, A. Histoire de Vergy, p. 46, cited in Bouchard (1987), p. 307.
[102] Bouchard (1987), p. 309, citing Duchesne, A. (1619) Histoire des roys, ducs et comtes de Bourgogne (Paris), p. 387.

Per Med Lands (Ref #1):
     "m [secondly] as her first husband, ADELAIS, daughter of --- (-after 18 Oct 984). "Lanbertus comes [et]…Adeleydis uxor mea" made a joint donation of "capellam beati Martini in villa Vigoseto" to Cluny by charter dated 978[474]. If Adelais was the mother of all of Comte Lambert's children, she could not have been born later than [930/32]. This is early if she also gave birth to her son by her second marriage after 978. The date would of course be later if Adelais was Comte Lambert's second wife, as suggested above. The origin of Adelais has been the subject of much speculation. Settipani has suggested[475] that she was the daughter of Hugues Comte en Bourgogne and his wife Willa von Thurgau. Chaume suggested that Adelais was the daughter or granddaughter of Charles Constantin Comte de Vienne[476]. Bouchard sets out several different theories concerning Adelais's origin, with the aim mainly of explaining Lambert's accession to Chalon by inheritance through his wife. However, none appears to be based on any primary documentation and Bouchard concludes that she prefers "to leave Adelais's origins unknown"[477]. An earlier theory was that Adelais was the sister of "Wera" Ctss de Meaux[478], which would mean that she was Adelais, daughter of Giselbert Duke of Burgundy & his wife Ermengarde [of Burgundy]. Duchesne suggested that she was the daughter of Robert Comte de Meaux et de Troyes[479], although this would mean that the two wives of Geoffroy I Comte d'Anjou were sisters, no mention of which has so far been found in contemporary sources. Another suggestion is that Adelais Ctss de Chalon was the same person as Wera-Adelais Ctss de Meaux. However, this is even more unlikely from a chronological perspective considering the estimated birth date of Wera-Adelais and the fact that Adelais de Chalon gave birth to at least one child by her second husband, Geoffroy Comte d'Anjou, after her marriage in 979. It would also mean that Comte Geoffroy married, as his second wife, his first wife's mother which is unlikely to have been accepted by the church. In 1619, Duchesne[480] suggested that Adelais was the sister of Guillaume I Comte d'Arles. Adelais married secondly (Mar 979) as his second wife, Geoffroi I "Grisegonelle" Comte d'Anjou, who acted as Comte de Chalon until his death in 987. "Gausfredus comes [et]…Adeleidis uxor mea" jointly donated land in "pago Cabilonensi" by charter dated Mar 979, her first marriage being deduced from "Hugo filius Lanberti comitis" acting jointly with them and signing "Hugonis filii eius" directly after "Adeleidis" in the subscriptions[481]. "Gauzfredi comitis, Adaleidis comitissa" subscribed a charter dated 18 Oct 984[482]."
Med Lands cites:
[474] Cluny, Tome II, 1444 bis, p. 755.
[475] Jackman, p. 87, citing Settipani 'Les origines maternelles d'Otte-Guillaume', Annales de Bourgogne, Tome 66, 1994, pp 48-49 [not yet consulted].
[476] Bouchard (1987), p. 309, citing Chaume, M. (1925-1931) Les origines du duché de Bourgogne 2 Vols. reprint 1977 (Dijon), Vol. 1, p. 447 n. 2 [not yet consulted].
[477] Bouchard (1987), p. 309.
[478] Lot (1891), pp. 323-34, and Poupardin (1907), pp. 206 and 417, cited in Bouchard (1987), p. 309.
[479] Duchesne (1625) Vergy, p. 46, cited in Bouchard (1987), p. 307.
[480] Bouchard (1987), p. 309, citing Duchesne (1619), p. 387.
[481] Cluny Tome II, 1474, p. 528.
[482] Cluny Tome II, 1701, p. 723.11,12


Adélaïde/Adelais (?) and Geoffroi I "Grisegonelle" (?) Comte d'Anjou
Per Genealogy.EU (Carolin1): "G1. Adelaide de Vermandois, *934, +982; 1m: 7.12.954 Lambert de Chalons; 2m: III.979 Cte Geoffroy I d'Anjou (*938 +987.)13"

Adélaïde/Adelais (?) and Geoffroi I "Grisegonelle" (?) Comte d'Anjou
Per Genealogy.EU: "Geoffroy I "Grisgonelle", Cte d'Anjou (960-987), *938/ca 940, +k.a.21.7.987; 1m: ca 965 Adéle de Donzy (*ca 950 +974); 2m: III.979 Adelaide de Vermandois (*934 +975/978/982), dau.of Duke Giselbert of Burgundy (?)8"
Adélaïde/Adelais (?) was a witness to the Per Racines et Histoire: "1) Geoffroi 1er (Gaufridus ou Gauzfredus) d’Anjou dit «Grisegonelle» ° 938/40 +X 21/07/987 (siège de Marçon, près Château-du-Loir) comte d’Anjou (958/60)
ép. 1) ~965 ou peu avant Adèle de Meaux (alias «de Vermandois») ° ~950 + après 06/03/974 (fille de Robert, comte de Meaux et de Troyes, et d’Adélaïs «Werra» de Bourgogne)
ou Adélaïs de Donzy (Bourgogne) ° ~950 + 12/12/975 (Angers) comtesse de Chalons et Beaune (fille de Gilbert) (citée pour un don à Saint-Aubin d’Angers par charte 06/03/974) Per Racines et Histoire: "1) Geoffroi 1er (Gaufridus ou Gauzfredus) d’Anjou dit «Grisegonelle» ° 938/40 +X 21/07/987 (siège de Marçon, près Château-du-Loir) comte d’Anjou (958/60)
ép. 1) ~965 ou peu avant Adèle de Meaux (alias «de Vermandois») ° ~950 + après 06/03/974 (fille de Robert, comte de Meaux et de Troyes, et d’Adélaïs «Werra» de Bourgogne)
ou Adélaïs de Donzy (Bourgogne) ° ~950 + 12/12/975 (Angers) comtesse de Chalons et Beaune (fille de Gilbert) (citée pour un don à Saint-Aubin d’Angers par charte 0Per Racines et Histoire: "1) Geoffroi 1er (Gaufridus ou Gauzfredus) d’Anjou dit «Grisegonelle» ° 938/40 +X 21/07/987 (siège de Marçon, près Château-du-Loir) comte d’Anjou (958/60)
ép. 1) ~965 ou peu avant Adèle de Meaux (alias «de Vermandois») ° ~950 + après 06/03/974 (fille de Robert, comte de Meaux et de Troyes, et d’Adélaïs «Werra» de Bourgogne)
ou Adélaïs de Donzy (Bourgogne) ° ~950 + 12/12/975 (Angers) comtesse de Chalons et Beaune (fille de Gilbert) (citée pour un don à Saint-Aubin d’Angers par charte 06/03/974) Per Racines et Histoire: "1) Geoffroi 1er (Gaufridus ou Gauzfredus) d’Anjou dit «Grisegonelle» ° 938/40 +X 21/07/987 (siège de Marçon, près Château-du-Loir) comte d’Anjou (958/60)
ép. 1) ~965 ou peu avant Adèle de Meaux (alias «de Vermandois») ° ~950 + après 06/03/974 (fille de Robert, comte de Meaux et de Troyes, et d’Adélaïs «Werra» de Bourgogne)
ou Adélaïs de Donzy (Bourgogne) ° ~950 + 12/12/975 (Angers) comtesse de Chalons et Beaune (fille de Gilbert) (citée pour un don à Saint-Aubin d’Angers pa[NB: The identification of Geoffroi's 1st wife as "Adélaïs de Donzy" has been discarded by others.]
ép. ??? 2) 02 ou 09/03/979 Adélaïs ? + après 18/10/984 (veuve de Lambert, comte de Chalon) [?? cette 2° épouse (déduite de l’existence de Maurice, demi-frère de Foulques Nerra) fait encore l’objet de recherches : selon Settipani, fille d’Hugues, comte de Bourgogne, et de Willa von Thurgau ; selon Chaume, fille ou petite-fille de Charles-Constantin, comte de Vienne ; selon d’autres sources, soeur de Werra, comtesse de Meaux, ou encore fille de Gislebert, duc de Bourgogne, comte de Chalon-sur-Saône et de Troyes, et d’Ermengarde de Dijon ; selon Duchesne, fille de Robert, comte de Meaux et Troyes et donc soeur de la 1° épouse de Geoffroi..; Selon le même en 1619, soeur de Guillaume 1er, comte d’Arles ?? ]" with Geoffroi I "Grisegonelle" (?) Comte d'Anjou and Adèle de Troyes.14

Family 1

Lambert (?) Cte de Châlons b. c 930, d. 22 Feb 979
Children

Family 2

Geoffroi I "Grisegonelle" (?) Comte d'Anjou b. bt 938 - 940, d. 21 Jul 987
Child

Citations

  1. [S1702] The Henry Project: The ancestors of king Henry II of England, An experiment in cooperative medieval genealogy on the internet, online http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/henry.htm, Adélaïde: http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/prov/adela003.htm. Hereinafter cited as The Henry Project.
  2. [S1490] Genealogics Website (oiginated by Leo van de Pas, continued by Ian Fettes), online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Adelais: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00177412&tree=LEO. Hereinafter cited as Genealogics Website.
  3. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, Vermandois, Valois & Vexinp. 4, http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Vermandois-Valois-Vexin.pdf. Hereinafter cited as Racines et Histoire.
  4. [S2203] Foundation for Medieval Genealogy (FMG): MEDIEVAL LANDS - A prosopography of medieval European noble and royal families, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/burgdbchalo.htm#LambertDijondied979. Hereinafter cited as FMG Medieval Lands Website.
  5. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Lambert: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00106087&tree=LEO
  6. [S2374] Find a Grave, online http://www.findagrave.com/, Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 08 November 2019), memorial page for Adele of Meaux (unknown–unknown), Find A Grave Memorial no. 82326968, citing Saint Aubin Abbey, Angers, Departement de Maine-et-Loire, Pays de la Loire, France ; Maintained by Kat (contributor 47496397), at: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/82326968/adele-of_meaux. Hereinafter cited as Find a Grave.
  7. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Geoffrey I: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020193&tree=LEO
  8. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, online http://genealogy.euweb.cz/index.html, unknown author (e-mail address), downloaded updated 15 May 2003, Anjou 1 page (The House of Anjou): http://genealogy.euweb.cz/anjou/anjou1.html#Erm
  9. [S2203] FMG Medieval Lands Website, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/ANJOU,%20MAINE.htm#GeoffroyIdied987B.
  10. [S1583] Peter Stewart, "Stewart email 23 Feb 2004 "Re: Adelais and Bonne: Whose the mom?"," e-mail message from e-mail address (unknown address) to e-mail address, 23 Feb 2004. Hereinafter cited as "Stewart email 23 Feb 2004."
  11. [S2203] FMG Medieval Lands Website, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, Ref #1: https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/ANJOU,%20MAINE.htm#GeoffroyIdied987B.
  12. [S2203] FMG Medieval Lands Website, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, Ref #2: https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/burgdbchalo.htm#LambertDijondied979
  13. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, updated 15 May 2003, Carolin1: http://genealogy.euweb.cz/carolin/carolin1.html
  14. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, Comtes de Gâtinais et d’Anjou (& 1ers Plantagenêts), p. 4: http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Anjou-Gatinais.pdf
  15. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Hugues I: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00106088&tree=LEO
  16. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Lambert: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00106087&tree=LEO
  17. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Mahaut de Chalon: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00106089&tree=LEO
  18. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Donzy.pdf, p. 2.
  19. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Maurice de Anjou: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00637924&tree=LEO
  20. [S1702] The Henry Project, online http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/henry.htm, Geoffroy I "Grisegonelle": http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/prov/geoff001.htm

Foulques II "le Bon" (?) Comte d'Anjou1,2,3

M, #4838, b. between 905 and 910, d. 11 November 958
FatherFoulques I "le Roux" (?) Vcte de Tours et d'Anjou, Cte de Nantes, Cte d'Anjou1,2,4,5 b. c 870, d. 942
MotherRoscilla (?) de Loches, dame de Loches, La Haye et Villandry1,2,5 b. c 874, d. Jul 929
ReferenceGAV28 EDV28
Last Edited17 Apr 2020
     Foulques II "le Bon" (?) Comte d'Anjou was born between 905 and 910 at Anjou, France; Wikipedia says b. c 905; Genealogics says b. 910.2,1,6,7 He married Gerberge (?) d'Arles, du Maine in 937 at France;
His 1st wife.1,8,9,2,6,5,10 Foulques II "le Bon" (?) Comte d'Anjou married Roscilla (?) de Blois, daughter of Theobald I 'le Vieux' (?) Count of Chartres and Bourges and Richilde (?) de Bourges, in 954;
His 2nd wife; Her 2nd husband; Med Lands says m. aft 952; Wikipedia (Fr.) and Racines et Histoire say m. 954.2,11,5
Foulques II "le Bon" (?) Comte d'Anjou died in 958.8
Foulques II "le Bon" (?) Comte d'Anjou died on 11 November 958 at Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France (now).1,2,5
Foulques II "le Bon" (?) Comte d'Anjou died circa 960; per Stewart:
     "Foulques II, known as Foulques le Bon, was living in September 958 when he was present at an assembly of bishops and nobles according to a notice in the cartulary of Saint-Florent de Saumur ("Anno itaque ab Incarn. Domini DCCCCLVIII. Indict. I. contigit ut Placitus fieret in confinio Andegavorum Turonorumque in Verrore videlicet"... in præsentia nobilissimorum Comitum Theobaldi atque Fulconis ... S. Theobaldi Comitis. S. Fulconis Comitis qui hanc conscriptionem fieri rogaverunt ... Datum mense Septembris anno IV. Hlotharii regis").
     "His death was wrongly placed on 11 November 956 (in a passage with a leper miraculously disappearing followed by St Martin appearing to explain that this had been Jesus Christ in disguise) by a 13th-century chronicler ("Anno Othonis XXIo et Lotharii regis Francorum IIo, Fulco Bonus comes Andegavensis ad festum Beati Martini veniens ... Nocte sequenti apparuit comiti Beatus Martinus ... Cumque in crastinum in choro Beati Martini missam dominicam audisset ... spiritum exhalavit anno comitatus XVIIIo ").
     "In an article published in 1895 René Merlet retained this date but arbitrarily transferred the event to 11 November 960 on the dubious grounds that Fulco was living when Nantes was besieged by Normans in the course of that year.
     "A 14th-century chronicler placed his death in 958 without a specific date ("DCCCCLVIII. Fulcho Bonus comes Andegavensium obit").
     "A charter for Saint-Florent de Saumur dated September 960 is usually cited as providing the terminus ante quem, because it was subscribed by his son & heir Geoffroy Grisegonelle as count (anno ab incarnatione Domini et redemptione DCCCCLX ... S. Gausfredi comitis ... Datum mense septembrio, anno V regni Lotharii regis""). This is bolstered by a list of counts and bishops of Anjou, written in 1155, stating that Geoffroy, who died in July 987, was count for 27 years ("Gaufridus comes, annis XXVII").
     "The terminus can be pushed back by six months: an original charter for Saint-Julien de Tours in the municipal archives of Rheims (collection Tarbé, carton 1 no 8) shows that Geoffroy was count by March 960 ("ego siquidem Gauzfredus, rerum Sanctae Genofefae rector ... Signum Gauzfredi comitis ... Data in mense marcio, anno VI regnante Hlotherio rege").
     "A transcription and further details of this charter can be found at: http://www.cn-telma.fr/originaux/charte9/
     "(_Chartes originales antérieures à 1121 conservées en France_, no. 9)."12
Foulques II "le Bon" (?) Comte d'Anjou was buried circa 960 at Basilique de St-Martin, Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France (now),

; From Find A Grave:
     BIRTH     21 Jun 909, Departement de Maine-et-Loire, Pays de la Loire, France
     DEATH     11 Nov 960 (aged 51), Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France
     b. 909, d. Nov. 11, 960
     Fulk II, Count of Anjou (942-960), was a son of Fulk the Red and his wife Roscilla de Loches, daughter of Warnerius, Seigneur de Villentrois. He succeeded his father in 942 as the second count of Anjou, also called the count of Angers, and remained in power until 960.
     The Angevins, Fulk II included, had become particularly adept at establishing marriage alliances that furthered their goals. His father, Fulk the Red had arranged his marriage to a Carolingian, Gerberga, the daughter of Ratburnus I Viscount of Vienne. Among other things this alliance opened the doors for their daughter Adelaide-Blanche to marry a future king of France and their son Guy to become Bishop of le Puy.
     Family Members
     Parents
      Fulk I de Anjou
      Roscille des Loches
     Spouse
      Gerberge du Maine 913–952
     Siblings
      Adele d'Anjou Vexin 924–948
     Children
      Geoffroy I de Anjou
      Adelaide d'Anjou 940–1026
     BURIAL     Basilique de St-Martin, Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France
     Created by: Angie Swann
     Added: 27 Mar 2015
     Find A Grave Memorial 144252511
     SPONSORED BY Christian H. F. Riley.13
     Foulques II "le Bon" (?) Comte d'Anjou
Per Genealogy.EU: "Foulques II "le Bon", Cte d'Anjou (942-960), *ca 920, +11.11.958; 1m: 937 Gerberga de Maine (*ca 913 +by 952); 2m: after 952 N, widow of Alain, Duc de Bretagne; all kids were by 1m."1

GAV-28 EDV-28 GKJ-29.

Foulques II "le Bon" (?) Comte d'Anjou
Per Wikipedia:
     "Fulk II of Anjou (c. 905 — 960), called le Bon ("the Good") was Count of Anjou from 942 to his death.
Life
     "Fulk II born c.?905[1] was a son of Fulk the Red and his wife Roscilla de Loches, daughter of Warnerius, Seigneur de Villentrois.[2] He succeeded his father in 942 as the second count of Anjou,[3] also called the count of Angers, and remained in power until 960.[4]
     "The Angevins, Fulk II included, had become particularly adept at establishing marriage alliances that furthered their goals.[5] His father, Fulk the Red had arranged his marriage to a Carolingian, Gerberga, the daughter of Ratburnus I Viscount of Vienne.[6] Among other things this alliance opened the doors for their daughter Adelaide-Blanche to marry a future king of France and their son Guy to become Bishop of le Puy.[6]
     "After her death c.?952 Fulk made another astute political marriage to Adelaide, the widow of Alan II, Duke of Brittany. Alan II had also been Count of Nantes and through this marriage Fulk gained influence in, and possibly control of, Nantes.[7] Adelaide was also the sister of Theobald I, Count of Blois which permitted Fulk II to form an alliance with the House of Blois.[6]
Family
     "By his spouse, Gerberge, a woman of unknown origins,[8] Fulk II had several children:
-- Adelaide-Blanche of Anjou, married five times.[2]
-- Geoffrey I, Count of Anjou, married Adelaide of Vermandois.[2]
-- Bouchard, Count of Vendome.[2]
-- Guy of Anjou, Bishop of le Puy.[2]
-- Humbert d'Anjou, mentioned 957.[2]
-- Fulk II had no known issue with Adelaide.
Death
     "Fulk died in 960, at the relatively old age of 55.[9] He was succeeded by his 20-year-old son Geoffrey Greymantle.[2]
Notes
a. Refer to Bernard S. Bachrach, "Fulk Nerra: Neo-Roman Consul, 987-1040" (California, 1993) 261 and 262 for a useful genealogy of the Angevin comital line.
References
1. K.S.B. Keats-Rohan, Family Trees and the Root of Politics; A Prosopography of Britain and France from the Tenth to the Twelfth Century (The Boydell Press, Woodbridge, UK, 1997), p. 255
2. Detlev Schwennicke, Europäische Stammtafeln: Stammtafeln zur Geschichte der Europäischen Staaten, Neue Folge, Band III Teilband 1 (Verlag von J. A. Stargardt, Marburg, Germany, 1984), Tafel 116
3. Jim Bradbury, The Capetians: Kings of France, 987-1328 (Hambledon Continuum, London & New York, 2007), p. 56
4. Pierre Riché, The Carolingians; A Family Who Forged Europe, Trans. Michael Idomir Allen (University of Pennsylvania Press, Philadelphia, 1993), p. 264
5. Bernard S. Bachrach, Fulk Nerra the Neo-Roman Consul, 987-1040 (University of California Press, 1993), p. xi
6. Bernard S. Bachrach, Fulk Nerra the Neo-Roman Consul, 987-1040 (University of California Press, 1993), p. 7
7. Bernard S. Bachrach, 'The Idea of the Angevin Empire', Albion: A Quarterly Journal Concerned with British Studies, Vol. 10, No. 4 (Winter,1978), p. 295
8. Those of My Blood: Creating Noble Families in Medieval Francia By Constance Brittain Bouchard, p.23
9. Bernard S. Bachrach, Fulk Nerra the Neo-Roman Consul, 987-1040 (University of California Press, 1993), p. 261."7



Foulques II "le Bon" (?) Comte d'Anjou
Per Genealogics: "Foulques was the son of Foulques I, count of Anjou, and Roselle de Loche. In 937 he married Gerberge de Tours. Four of their children would have progeny, including his heir Geoffrey I. He was often at war with the Bretons. He seems to have been a man of culture, a poet and an artist. By reputation a saintly man, he dressed as a cleric. Of Louis IV, king of France, who had mocked his piety, Foulques commented, 'an illiterate king is a crowned ass'. Foulques died in 960."6



Reference: Genealogics cites:
     1. The Lineage and Ancestry of H.R.H. Prince Charles, Prince of Wales, Edinburgh, 1977, Paget, Gerald. 139
     2. Biogr. details drawn from Wikipedia .14


Foulques II "le Bon" (?) Comte d'Anjou
Per Med Lands:
     "FOULQUES d'Anjou, son of FOULQUES I "le Roux" Comte d'Anjou & his wife Roscille de "Loches" (-11 Nov 958). The Gesta Consulum Andegavorum names "Fulco Rufus alium [filium] …tertium iuniorem…alter Fulco cognominatus Bonus" when recording that he succeeded his father[52]. He succeeded his father as FOULQUES II "le Bon" Comte d'Anjou. He made peace with the Normans.
     "m firstly ([937]) GERBERGE, daughter of --- (-before 952). "Gaufridus…Andecavorum comes" names "patris mei Fulconis, matris quoque meæ Gerbergæ" in his charter dated 19 Jun 966[53]. Maurice Chaume suggested that she was Gerberge, daughter of Geoffroy Vicomte d'Orléans [Comte de Gâtinais], based on onomastic reasons only to explain the introduction of the name Geoffroy into the family of the Comtes d'Anjou[54].
     "m secondly (after 952) as her second husband, --- de Blois, widow of ALAIN II “Barbetorte” Duke of Brittany, daughter of THIBAUT [I] "l'Ancien" Comte de Blois & his [second wife Richilde ---]. The Chronicle of Nantes records the marriage of "Theobaldus comes Blesensis…sororem suam relictam Alani Barbætortæ ducis" and "Fulconi comiti Andegavensi"[55].
     "Foulques II & his first wife had four children."
Med Lands cites:
[52] Chronica de Gesta Consulum Andegavorum, Chroniques d'Anjou, pp. 66 and 67.
[53] Angers Saint-Aubin, Tome I, 2, p. 4.
[54] Saint-Phalle 'Les comtes de Gâtinais aux X et XI siècles' (2000), p. 239, citing Chaume, M. (1925) Les origines du duché de Bourgogne (Dijon) Vol. I, p. 534.
[55] Chronique de Nantes, XXXVII, pp. 107-8.5
Foulques II "le Bon" (?) Comte d'Anjou was also known as Fulk II (?) Count of Anjou.

Foulques II "le Bon" (?) Comte d'Anjou and Roscilla (?) de Blois
Per Racines et Histoire: "Foulques II «Le Bon» ° 910/20+ 11/11/958 comte d’Anjou (~941/42)
     ép. 1) 937 Gerberge du Maine alias «du Gâtinais» ° 913/15 + 952/53
     ép. 2) ~954 Roscilla de Blois ° 925 (veuve d’Alain, duc de Bretagne.)10"

Foulques II "le Bon" (?) Comte d'Anjou was Comte d'Anjou (See attached map of NW France ca 1050 from Wikipedia: By Osbern - Own work, CC BY-SA 3.0, https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?curid=1737773) between 942 and 960.1

Family 1

Child

Family 3

Roscilla (?) de Blois b. 925

Citations

  1. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, online http://genealogy.euweb.cz/index.html, unknown author (e-mail address), downloaded updated 15 May 2003, Anjou 1 page (The House of Anjou): http://genealogy.euweb.cz/anjou/anjou1.html#Erm
  2. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Anjou-Gatinais.pdf, p. 3. Hereinafter cited as Racines et Histoire.
  3. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Anjou-Gatinais.pdf, p. 4.
  4. [S1490] Genealogics Website (oiginated by Leo van de Pas, continued by Ian Fettes), online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Foulques I, Comte d'Anjou: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020234&tree=LEO. Hereinafter cited as Genealogics Website.
  5. [S2203] Foundation for Medieval Genealogy (FMG): MEDIEVAL LANDS - A prosopography of medieval European noble and royal families, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/ANJOU,%20MAINE.htm#FoulquesIIdied958B. Hereinafter cited as FMG Medieval Lands Website.
  6. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Foulques II 'the Good': https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020237&tree=LEO
  7. [S1953] Wikipedia: The Free Encyclopedia, online http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fulk_II,_Count_of_Anjou. Hereinafter cited as Wikipedia.
  8. [S1707] J Bunot, "Bunot email 26 Feb 2005: "Ahnentafel Petronille de Comminges-Bigorre"," e-mail message from e-mail address (unknown address) to e-mail address, 26 Feb 2005. Hereinafter cited as "Bunot email 26 Feb 2005."
  9. [S1779] J Bunot, "Bunot email 24 Jan 2005: "Re: d'Auvergne -> Toulouse or Arles"," e-mail message from e-mail address (unknown address) to e-mail address, 24 Jan 2005. Hereinafter cited as "Bunot email 24 Jan 2005."
  10. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, Comtes de Gâtinais et d’Anjou (& 1ers Plantagenêts), p. 3: http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Anjou-Gatinais.pdf
  11. [S4742] Wikipédia - L'encyclopédie libre, online https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikip%C3%A9dia:Accueil_principal, Foulques II d'Anjou: https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foulques_II_d%27Anjou. Hereinafter cited as Wikipédia (Fr.).
  12. [S2404] Peter Stewart, "Stewart email 24 Nov 2011: "Death of Foulques II, count of Anjou"," e-mail message from e-mail address (unknown address) to e-mail address, 24 Nov 2011. Hereinafter cited as "Stewart email 24 Nov 2011."
  13. [S2374] Find a Grave, online http://www.findagrave.com/, Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 12 October 2019), memorial page for Fulk II of Anjou (21 Jun 909–11 Nov 960), Find A Grave Memorial no. 144252511, citing Basilique de St-Martin, Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France ; Maintained by Angie Swann (contributor 48313732), at: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/144252511/fulk_ii_of-anjou. Hereinafter cited as Find a Grave.
  14. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Engelbert II: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00080236&tree=LEO
  15. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Craon.pdf, p. 2.
  16. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Geoffrey I: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020193&tree=LEO
  17. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Adelheid d'Anjou: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020247&tree=LEO

Gerberge (?) d'Arles, du Maine1

F, #4839, b. between 913 and 915, d. before 952
ReferenceGAV28 EDV28
Last Edited30 Mar 2020
     Gerberge (?) d'Arles, du Maine was born between 913 and 915 at Maine, France.2,3,4,5,1,6 She married Foulques II "le Bon" (?) Comte d'Anjou, son of Foulques I "le Roux" (?) Vcte de Tours et d'Anjou, Cte de Nantes, Cte d'Anjou and Roscilla (?) de Loches, dame de Loches, La Haye et Villandry, in 937 at France;
His 1st wife.5,7,8,1,9,10,6
Gerberge (?) d'Arles, du Maine died before 952.7,5,8,1,11,12,6
     Gerberge (?) d'Arles, du Maine
Per Med Lands:
     "m firstly ([937]) GERBERGE, daughter of --- (-before 952). "Gaufridus…Andecavorum comes" names "patris mei Fulconis, matris quoque meæ Gerbergæ" in his charter dated 19 Jun 966[53]. Maurice Chaume suggested that she was Gerberge, daughter of Geoffroy Vicomte d'Orléans [Comte de Gâtinais], based on onomastic reasons only to explain the introduction of the name Geoffroy into the family of the Comtes d'Anjou[54].
     "Foulques II & his first wife had four children."
Med Lands cites:
[53] Angers Saint-Aubin, Tome I, 2, p. 4.
[54] Saint-Phalle 'Les comtes de Gâtinais aux X et XI siècles' (2000), p. 239, citing Chaume, M. (1925) Les origines du duché de Bourgogne (Dijon) Vol. I, p. 534.10
GAV-28 EDV-28 GKJ-29.

Reference: Genealogics cites:
     1. The Lineage and Ancestry of H.R.H. Prince Charles, Prince of Wales, Edinburgh, 1977, Paget, Gerald. 139
     2. Les seize quartiers des Reines et Imperatrices Francaises, 1977, Saillot, Jacques. 175.12
Gerberge (?) d'Arles, du Maine was also known as Geberge (?) du Maine.11 Gerberge (?) d'Arles, du Maine was also known as Geberge (?) de Gatinais.8 Gerberge (?) d'Arles, du Maine was also known as Geberge (?) de Tours.12
Gerberge (?) d'Arles, du Maine was a witness to the Per Racines et Histoire: "Foulques II «Le Bon» ° 910/20+ 11/11/958 comte d’Anjou (~941/42)
     ép. 1) 937 Gerberge du Maine alias «du Gâtinais» ° 913/15 + 952/53
     ép. 2) ~954 Roscilla de Blois ° 925 (veuve d’Alain, duc de Bretagne)"

with Roscilla (?) de Blois and Foulques II "le Bon" (?) Comte d'Anjou.6

Citations

  1. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Anjou-Gatinais.pdf, p. 3. Hereinafter cited as Racines et Histoire.
  2. [S602] Inc. Brøderbund Software, World Family Tree Vol. 14, Ed. 1, Family #2699 (n.p.: Release date: October 20, 1997, unknown publish date).
  3. [S619] Inc. Br²derbund Software, GEDCOM file imported on 27 Dec 1999 from World Family Tree Vol. 6, Ed. 1, Family #6-1556 (n.p.: Release date: August 22, 1996, unknown publish date).
  4. [S640] Inc. Brøderbund Software, World Family Tree Vol. L1, Ed. 1, Family #0021 (n.p.: Release date: October 30, 1998, unknown publish date).
  5. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, online http://genealogy.euweb.cz/index.html, unknown author (e-mail address), downloaded updated 15 May 2003, Anjou 1 page (The House of Anjou): http://genealogy.euweb.cz/anjou/anjou1.html#Erm
  6. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, Comtes de Gâtinais et d’Anjou (& 1ers Plantagenêts), p. 3: http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Anjou-Gatinais.pdf
  7. [S1707] J Bunot, "Bunot email 26 Feb 2005: "Ahnentafel Petronille de Comminges-Bigorre"," e-mail message from e-mail address (unknown address) to e-mail address, 26 Feb 2005. Hereinafter cited as "Bunot email 26 Feb 2005."
  8. [S1779] J Bunot, "Bunot email 24 Jan 2005: "Re: d'Auvergne -> Toulouse or Arles"," e-mail message from e-mail address (unknown address) to e-mail address, 24 Jan 2005. Hereinafter cited as "Bunot email 24 Jan 2005."
  9. [S1490] Genealogics Website (oiginated by Leo van de Pas, continued by Ian Fettes), online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Foulques II 'the Good': https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020237&tree=LEO. Hereinafter cited as Genealogics Website.
  10. [S2203] Foundation for Medieval Genealogy (FMG): MEDIEVAL LANDS - A prosopography of medieval European noble and royal families, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/ANJOU,%20MAINE.htm#FoulquesIIdied958B. Hereinafter cited as FMG Medieval Lands Website.
  11. [S2374] Find a Grave, online http://www.findagrave.com/, Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 12 October 2019), memorial page for Gerberge du Maine (913–952), Find A Grave Memorial no. 146168483, citing Basilique de St-Martin, Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France ; Maintained by Memerizion (contributor 48072664), at: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/146168483/gerberge-du_maine. Hereinafter cited as Find a Grave.
  12. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Gerberge de Tours: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020238&tree=LEO
  13. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Anjou-Gatinais.pdf, p. 4.
  14. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Geoffrey I: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020193&tree=LEO
  15. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Adelheid d'Anjou: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020247&tree=LEO

Eleonore de Châtillon1

F, #4840, d. after 1357
FatherGuy III de Châtillon Comte de St. Pol1,2,3 b. bt 1254 - 1258, d. 6 Apr 1317
MotherMarie de Dreux de Bretagne, Dame d'Elincourt1,2 b. 1268, d. 5 May 1339
Last Edited14 Oct 2019
     Eleonore de Châtillon married Jean III Malet Seigneur de Graville, de Séez et de Bernay, son of Jean II Malet Seigneur de Graville, de Séez et de Bernay and Jeanne/Anne de Wavrin.4
Eleonore de Châtillon died after 1357.1
     Reference: Leo van de Pas cites: Europäische Stammtafeln, J.A. Stargardt Verlag Marburg., Detlev Schwennicke, Editor, Reference: 7:18.1

Citations

  1. [S1490] Genealogics Website (oiginated by Leo van de Pas, continued by Ian Fettes), online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Eleonore de Châtillon: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00546862&tree=LEO. Hereinafter cited as Genealogics Website.
  2. [S1953] Wikipedia: The Free Encyclopedia, online http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marie_of_Brittany,_Countess_of_Saint-Pol. Hereinafter cited as Wikipedia.
  3. [S1953] Wikipedia, online http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guy_IV,_Count_of_Saint-Pol.
  4. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Jean III Malet: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00546861&tree=LEO
  5. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Robert III Malet: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00260811&tree=LEO

Foulques I "le Roux" (?) Vcte de Tours et d'Anjou, Cte de Nantes, Cte d'Anjou1,2

M, #4841, b. circa 870, d. 942
FatherIngelger I (?) vicomte d'Angers3,4 b. bt 845 - 850, d. 888
MotherAelindeAdelaide d'Amboise5 b. c 844
ReferenceGAV29 EDV29
Last Edited15 Apr 2020
     Foulques I "le Roux" (?) Vcte de Tours et d'Anjou, Cte de Nantes, Cte d'Anjou was born circa 870 at Anjou, France.1,2,6,7 He married Roscilla (?) de Loches, dame de Loches, La Haye et Villandry, daughter of GarnierGardier (?) Seigneur de Loches and Tescandra (?) des Loches, before 5 July 905.8,9,10,1,2,6
Foulques I "le Roux" (?) Vcte de Tours et d'Anjou, Cte de Nantes, Cte d'Anjou was buried in 942 at Basilique de St-Martin, Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France (now),

; From Find A Grave:
     BIRTH     unknown
     DEATH     unknown
     [birth date uncertain; died Aug 941/942]. French nobility. Count of Anjou. Eldest son of Ingeler of Anjou and his wife Adelais.
     Family Members
     Parents
      Ingelger of Anjou 850–888
      Adelais of Amboise of Anjou
     Spouse
      Roscille des Loches
     Children
      Fulk II of Anjou 909–960
      Adele d'Anjou Vexin 924–948
     BURIAL     Basilique de St-Martin, Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France
     Created by: Lutetia
     Added: 5 Sep 2014
     Find A Grave Memorial 135451648
     SPONSORED BY Christian H. F. Riley.11
Foulques I "le Roux" (?) Vcte de Tours et d'Anjou, Cte de Nantes, Cte d'Anjou died in 942; Genealogy.EU says d. 942; Genealogics says d. 938; Wikipedia says d. 942.1,2,6,7
     Reference: Genealogics cites: The Lineage and Ancestry of H.R.H. Prince Charles, Prince of Wales, Edinburgh, 1977, Paget, Gerald. 139.6


Foulques I "le Roux" (?) Vcte de Tours et d'Anjou, Cte de Nantes, Cte d'Anjou
Per Genealogy.EU: :Foulques I "le Roux", Vcte de Tours et d'Anjou (909-942), Cte de Nantes (908-919), Cte d'Anjou (929-941/2), *888, +941/2; m.before 5.7.905 Roscilla de "Loches" (*ca 874), dau.of Warnerius/Garnier, sn de Loches."1

Foulques I "le Roux" (?) Vcte de Tours et d'Anjou, Cte de Nantes, Cte d'Anjou
Per Wikipedia:
     "Fulk I of Anjou (c. 870 – 942) — Foulques le Roux ("Fulk the Red", i.e., "Red Falcon") — held the county of Anjou first as Viscount, then Count, until his death.
Life
     "Born about 870,[1] Fulk was the son of Ingelger of Anjou and Adelais of Amboise.[2] He was the first count of Anjou, ruling the county from about 908 to 942.[2] In 899 he became Viscount of Tours and in 905 Count of Tours.[2] About 900–918 he was Count of Nantes.[2] He increased his territory as a viscountcy of Angers and, around 929, he claimed the title count of Anjou. During his lordship, he was frequently at war with the Normans and the Bretons. He occupied the county of Nantes in 907, but abandoned it to the Bretons in 919. Fulk I died around 942.[2]
Family
     "Fulk married Roscille de Loches, daughter of Warnerius (Widone), Seigneur de Loches, de Villentrois, & de la Haye, and his wife Tecandra.[2] He and Roscille had:
** Guy (Wido), Bishop of Soissons († 970).[2][3]
** Fulk II. Succeeded his father as Count of Anjou.[2]

References
1. Keats-Rohan, K. S. B. (1997). Family Trees and the Root of Politics; A Prosopography of Britain and France from the Tenth to the Twelfth Century. Woodbridge: Boydell Press. p. 255.
2. Schwennicke, Detlev, ed. (1984). "Tafel 116". Europäische Stammtafeln: Stammtafeln zur Geschichte der Europäischen Staaten, Neue Folge. III. Marburg: J. A. Stargardt.
3. Fanning, Steven; Bachrach, Bernard S., eds. (2011). The Annals of Flodoard of Reims, 919–966. Toronto: University of Toronto Press. p. 30.
Further reading
** Seward, Desmond (2014). The Demon's Brood: A history of the Plantagent Dynasty. Pegasus Books. ISBN 1101606282.
** Jones, Dan (2012). The Plantagenets: The Warrior Kings and Queens Who Made England. London: HarperPress. ISBN 978-0-00-721392-4.7

Foulques I "le Roux" (?) Vcte de Tours et d'Anjou, Cte de Nantes, Cte d'Anjou
Per Genealogics:
     "Anjou was originally known as the _pagus andecavis,_ named after the Gaul tribe of Andecaves. At the end of the 9th century, Charles 'the Bald', king of _Francia occidentalis_ and later Holy Roman Emperor, allied himself to the duke of Brittany and expelled the Vikings from Anjou. He appointed Rutpert IV, Graf in Wormsgau, duke of Francia, an ancestor of the Capetian house, to protect the area against potential invaders.
     "At the end of the 9th century, the royal power faded away and feudal states emerged all over France. In 898 Foulques I 'le Roux' founded the first house of Anjou. He bore the hereditary title of count of Anjou. Foulques was the son of Ingelger, comte d'Anjou, and Aelinde, the daughter of Geoffroy I, comte de Gatinais. Foulques married Roselle de Loche, daughter of Gardier, seigneur de Loche. They had four children, of whom their son Foulques II would have progeny. Foulques I died about 938."6 GAV-29 EDV-29 GKJ-30. Foulques I "le Roux" (?) Vcte de Tours et d'Anjou, Cte de Nantes, Cte d'Anjou was also known as Fulk I (?) Count of Anjou. He was Comte d'Anjou between 898 and 942.1,7

Citations

  1. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, online http://genealogy.euweb.cz/index.html, unknown author (e-mail address), downloaded updated 15 May 2003, Anjou 1 page (The House of Anjou): http://genealogy.euweb.cz/anjou/anjou1.html#Erm
  2. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Anjou-Gatinais.pdf, p. 3. Hereinafter cited as Racines et Histoire.
  3. [S2374] Find a Grave, online http://www.findagrave.com/, Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 13 October 2019), memorial page for Ingelger of Anjou (850–888), Find A Grave Memorial no. 144253898, citing Basilique de St-Martin, Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France ; Maintained by Angie Swann (contributor 48313732), at: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/144253898/ingelger_of-anjou. Hereinafter cited as Find a Grave.
  4. [S1490] Genealogics Website (oiginated by Leo van de Pas, continued by Ian Fettes), online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Ingelger, Comte d'Anjou: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020231&tree=LEO. Hereinafter cited as Genealogics Website.
  5. [S2374] Find a Grave, online http://www.findagrave.com/, Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 13 October 2019), memorial page for Adelais of Amboise of Anjou (unknown–unknown), Find A Grave Memorial no. 189183095, citing Basilique de St-Martin, Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France ; Maintained by Our Family History (contributor 47719401), at: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/189183095/adelais-of_anjou
  6. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Foulques I, Comte d'Anjou: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020234&tree=LEO
  7. [S1953] Wikipedia: The Free Encyclopedia, online http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fulk_I,_Count_of_Anjou. Hereinafter cited as Wikipedia.
  8. [S602] Inc. Brøderbund Software, World Family Tree Vol. 14, Ed. 1, Family #2699 (n.p.: Release date: October 20, 1997, unknown publish date).
  9. [S616] Inc. Br²derbund Software, GEDCOM file imported on 26 Dec 1999 from World Family Tree Vol. 18, Ed. 1, Family #18-0770 (n.p.: Release date: March 27, 1998, unknown publish date).
  10. [S630] Unknown author, Broderbund WFT Vol. 2, Ed. 1, Tree #1822, Date of Import: 27 Jul 1997 (n.p.: n.pub., unknown publish date).
  11. [S2374] Find a Grave, online http://www.findagrave.com/, Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 13 October 2019), memorial page for Fulk I “Le Roux” de Anjou (unknown–unknown), Find A Grave Memorial no. 135451648, citing Basilique de St-Martin, Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France ; Maintained by Lutetia (contributor 46580078), at: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/135451648/fulk_i-de_anjou
  12. [S2203] Foundation for Medieval Genealogy (FMG): MEDIEVAL LANDS - A prosopography of medieval European noble and royal families, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/ANJOU,%20MAINE.htm#RoscilleMAlainIIBretagnedied952. Hereinafter cited as FMG Medieval Lands Website.
  13. [S2203] FMG Medieval Lands Website, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/ANJOU,%20MAINE.htm#FoulquesIIdied958B.
  14. [S1396] Burke's Peerage & Gentry Web Site, online http://www.burkes-peerage.net/sites/peerageandgentry/sitepages/home.asp, Sudeley Family Page. Hereinafter cited as Burke's Peerage & Gentry Web Site.
  15. [S2203] FMG Medieval Lands Website, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/ANJOU,%20MAINE.htm#AdelaMGautierIValoisdied987.
  16. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, Comtes de Gâtinais et d’Anjou (& 1ers Plantagenêts), p. 3: http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Anjou-Gatinais.pdf

Roscilla (?) de Loches, dame de Loches, La Haye et Villandry1,2

F, #4842, b. circa 874, d. July 929
FatherGarnierGardier (?) Seigneur de Loches1,2 b. c 844, d. 929
MotherTescandra (?) des Loches3 b. 860, d. 957
ReferenceGAV29 EDV29
Last Edited15 Apr 2020
     Roscilla (?) de Loches, dame de Loches, La Haye et Villandry was born circa 874 at Loches, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France.2,4 She married Foulques I "le Roux" (?) Vcte de Tours et d'Anjou, Cte de Nantes, Cte d'Anjou, son of Ingelger I (?) vicomte d'Angers and AelindeAdelaide d'Amboise, before 5 July 905.5,6,7,1,2,8
Roscilla (?) de Loches, dame de Loches, La Haye et Villandry was buried in July 929 at Basilique de St-Martin, Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France (now),

; From Find A Grave:
     BIRTH     unknown, Loches, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France
     DEATH     unknown, Angers, Departement de Maine-et-Loire, Pays de la Loire, France
     Birth: 874
     Death: 7/929
     Countess of Anjou
     Family Members
     Parents
      Garnier des Loches
      Tescandra des Loches
     Spouse
      Fulk I de Anjou
     Children
      Fulk II of Anjou 909–960
      Adele d'Anjou Vexin 924–948
     BURIAL     Basilique de St-Martin, Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France
     Created by: Memerizion
     Added: 7 May 2015
     Find A Grave Memorial 146168724.4
Roscilla (?) de Loches, dame de Loches, La Haye et Villandry died in July 929; Racines et Histoire says d. 938; Find A Grave says d. 7/929.2,4
     GAV-29 EDV-29 GKJ-30.

Roscilla (?) de Loches, dame de Loches, La Haye et Villandry
Roscilla de "Loches" (*ca 874), dau.of Warnerius/Garnier, sn de Loches.1

Citations

  1. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, online http://genealogy.euweb.cz/index.html, unknown author (e-mail address), downloaded updated 15 May 2003, Anjou 1 page (The House of Anjou): http://genealogy.euweb.cz/anjou/anjou1.html#Erm
  2. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Anjou-Gatinais.pdf, p. 3. Hereinafter cited as Racines et Histoire.
  3. [S2374] Find a Grave, online http://www.findagrave.com/, Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 13 October 2019), memorial page for Tescandra des Loches (unknown–unknown), Find A Grave Memorial no. 147090561, ; Maintained by Memerizion (contributor 48072664) Unknown, at: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/147090561/tescandra-des_loches. Hereinafter cited as Find a Grave.
  4. [S2374] Find a Grave, online http://www.findagrave.com/, Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 13 October 2019), memorial page for Roscille des Loches (unknown–unknown), Find A Grave Memorial no. 146168724, citing Basilique de St-Martin, Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France ; Maintained by Memerizion (contributor 48072664), at: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/146168724/roscille-des_loches
  5. [S602] Inc. Brøderbund Software, World Family Tree Vol. 14, Ed. 1, Family #2699 (n.p.: Release date: October 20, 1997, unknown publish date).
  6. [S616] Inc. Br²derbund Software, GEDCOM file imported on 26 Dec 1999 from World Family Tree Vol. 18, Ed. 1, Family #18-0770 (n.p.: Release date: March 27, 1998, unknown publish date).
  7. [S630] Unknown author, Broderbund WFT Vol. 2, Ed. 1, Tree #1822, Date of Import: 27 Jul 1997 (n.p.: n.pub., unknown publish date).
  8. [S1490] Genealogics Website (oiginated by Leo van de Pas, continued by Ian Fettes), online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Foulques I, Comte d'Anjou: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020234&tree=LEO. Hereinafter cited as Genealogics Website.
  9. [S2203] Foundation for Medieval Genealogy (FMG): MEDIEVAL LANDS - A prosopography of medieval European noble and royal families, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/ANJOU,%20MAINE.htm#RoscilleMAlainIIBretagnedied952. Hereinafter cited as FMG Medieval Lands Website.
  10. [S2203] FMG Medieval Lands Website, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/ANJOU,%20MAINE.htm#FoulquesIIdied958B.
  11. [S2203] FMG Medieval Lands Website, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/ANJOU,%20MAINE.htm#AdelaMGautierIValoisdied987.
  12. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, Comtes de Gâtinais et d’Anjou (& 1ers Plantagenêts), p. 3: http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Anjou-Gatinais.pdf

Ingelger I (?) vicomte d'Angers1,2

M, #4843, b. between 845 and 850, d. 888
FatherTertulle/Foulques (?) comte d'Anjou1,2,3,4 d. 870
MotherPeronelle/Petronilla (?) D'Auxerre, Countess of Anjou1,2,3 b. c 825
ReferenceGAV30 EDV30
Last Edited8 Nov 2019
     Ingelger I (?) vicomte d'Angers was born between 845 and 850 at Rennes, Departement d'Ille-et-Vilaine, Bretagne, France; Genealogics says b. est. 835; Find A Grave says b. 850.5,1,2,3,6 He married AelindeAdelaide d'Amboise, daughter of Geoffroy I (?) Comte de Gâtinais, circa 869 at France.5,1,2,6,7,3,8
Ingelger I (?) vicomte d'Angers died in 888 at St. Martin, Departement d'Eure-et-Loir, Centre, France (now).5,2,3,1,6
Ingelger I (?) vicomte d'Angers was buried in 888 at Basilique de St-Martin, Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France (now),

; From Find A Grave:
     BIRTH     850, Rennes, Departement d'Ille-et-Vilaine, Bretagne, France
     DEATH     888 (aged 37–38), Departement d'Eure-et-Loir, Centre, France
     b. 850, d. 888. Ingelger (or Ingelgarius) was a Frankish nobleman, who was the founder of the County of Anjou and of the original House of Anjou. Contemporary records refer to Ingelger as a miles optimus, a great military man.
     Around 877 he inherited his father Tertullus's lands in accordance with the Capitulary of Quierzy which Charles the Bald had issued. His father's holdings from the king included Château-Landon in beneficium, and he was a casatus in the Gâtinais and Francia. Contemporary records refer to Ingelger as a miles optimus, a great military man
     He married Adelais, whose maternal uncles were Adalard, Archbishop of Tours, and Raino, Bishop of Angers. Later Ingelger was appointed prefect (military commander) at Tours, then ruled by Adalard.
     At some point Ingelger was appointed Count of Anjou, at a time when the county stretched only as far west as the Mayenne River.
     Family Members
     Parents
      Tertullus De GâTinais
      Petronelle d'Auxerre d'Anjou
     Spouse
      Adelais of Amboise of Anjou
     Children
      Fulk I de Anjou
     BURIAL     Basilique de St-Martin, Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France
     Created by: Angie Swann
     Added: 27 Mar 2015
     Find A Grave Memorial 144253898.3
     GAV-30 EDV-30 GKJ-31.

Reference: Genealogics cites:
     1. The Lineage and Ancestry of H.R.H. Prince Charles, Prince of Wales, Edinburgh, 1977, Paget, Gerald. 139
     2. Europäische Stammtafeln, J.A. Stargardt Verlag, Marburg, Schwennicke, Detlev (Ed.) 3/1:116
     3. Henry Project , Baldwin, Stewart.6


Ingelger I (?) vicomte d'Angers
Per Genealogics:
     "Ingelger was a Frankish nobleman who stands at the head of the Plantagenet dynasty. Later generations of his family believed he was the son of Tertulle and Petronilla. He was born in Rennes.
     "Around 877 he inherited his father Tertulle's lands in accordance with the Capitulary of Quierzy which Emperor Charles 'the Bald' had issued. His father's holdings from the king included Château-Landon _in beneficium,_ and he was a _casatus_ in the Gâtinais and Francia. Contemporary records refer to Ingelger as a _miles optimus,_ a great military man.
     "Later family tradition makes his mother a relative of Hugues the Abbot, an influential counsellor of both Louis II and Louis III of France, from whom he received preferment. By Louis II, Ingelger was appointed viscount of Orléans, which was under the rule of its bishops at the time. At Orléans Ingelger made a matrimonial alliance with one of the leading families of Neustria, the lords of Amboise. He married Aelinde, daughter of Geoffroy I, comte de Gâtinais; her maternal uncles were Adalard, archbishop of Tours, and Raino, bishop of Angers. Later Ingelger was appointed prefect (military commander) at Tours, then ruled by Adalard.
     "At some point Ingelger was appointed count of Anjou, at a time when the county stretched only as far west as the Mayenne River. Later sources credit his appointment to his defence of the region from Vikings, but modern scholars have been more likely to see it as a result of his wife's influential relatives. He was buried in the Church of Saint-Martin at Châteauneuf-sur-Sarthe. He was succeeded by his son Foulques I 'the Red', who would have progeny."6 He was vicomte d'Angers.2

Citations

  1. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, online http://genealogy.euweb.cz/index.html, unknown author (e-mail address), downloaded updated 15 May 2003, Anjou 1 page (The House of Anjou): http://genealogy.euweb.cz/anjou/anjou1.html#Erm
  2. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Anjou-Gatinais.pdf, p. 3. Hereinafter cited as Racines et Histoire.
  3. [S2374] Find a Grave, online http://www.findagrave.com/, Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 13 October 2019), memorial page for Ingelger of Anjou (850–888), Find A Grave Memorial no. 144253898, citing Basilique de St-Martin, Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France ; Maintained by Angie Swann (contributor 48313732), at: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/144253898/ingelger_of-anjou. Hereinafter cited as Find a Grave.
  4. [S2374] Find a Grave, online http://www.findagrave.com/, Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 13 October 2019), memorial page for Tertullus De GâTinais (unknown–unknown), Find A Grave Memorial no. 146406423, citing Basilique de St-Martin, Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France ; Maintained by Angie Swann (contributor 48313732): at: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/146406423/tertullus-de_g_tinais
  5. [S602] Inc. Brøderbund Software, World Family Tree Vol. 14, Ed. 1, Family #2699 (n.p.: Release date: October 20, 1997, unknown publish date).
  6. [S1490] Genealogics Website (oiginated by Leo van de Pas, continued by Ian Fettes), online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Ingelger, Comte d'Anjou: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020231&tree=LEO. Hereinafter cited as Genealogics Website.
  7. [S2374] Find a Grave, online http://www.findagrave.com/, Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 13 October 2019), memorial page for Adelais of Amboise of Anjou (unknown–unknown), Find A Grave Memorial no. 189183095, citing Basilique de St-Martin, Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France ; Maintained by Our Family History (contributor 47719401), at: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/189183095/adelais-of_anjou
  8. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Aelinde: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020232&tree=LEO

AelindeAdelaide d'Amboise1

F, #4844, b. circa 844
FatherGeoffroy I (?) Comte de Gâtinais2
ReferenceGAV30 EDV30
Last Edited13 Oct 2019
     AelindeAdelaide d'Amboise was born at Gatinais, France.3,4 She was born circa 844 at Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France (now).5,6 She married Ingelger I (?) vicomte d'Angers, son of Tertulle/Foulques (?) comte d'Anjou and Peronelle/Petronilla (?) D'Auxerre, Countess of Anjou, circa 869 at France.5,1,6,7,8,9,10
AelindeAdelaide d'Amboise was buried at Basilique de St-Martin, Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France (now),

; From Find A Grave:
     BIRTH     unknown
     DEATH     unknown
     Adelais of Amboise - From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: Adelais of Amboise (sometimes called Aelinde) (fl. 865), came from an influential Frankish family in the Loire Valley. Through her mother, whose name is unknown, she was the niece of Adelard, Archbishop of Tours, and Raino, Bishop of Angers.[1] In 865, her uncles arranged a marriage for her to a Frankish man named Ingelger, described as a miles optimus,[2] whose devotion to Charles the Bald had been rewarded with land and military commands.[3] Adelais’ dowry included Buzençais, Châtillon-sur-Indre, and the fortress of Amboise,[4] which ultimately grew to be the royal residence known as the Château d'Amboise. Adelais and Ingelger, who has been identified as either a viscount[5] or the first count[6] of Anjou, were the parents of Fulk the Red, who became the first hereditary count of Anjou.[7] According to the Gesta Consulum Andegavorum, “after the death of her husband, Adelais was unjustly accused of adultery by a group of nobles led by ‘Guntrannus parens Ingelgerii’ but later exonerated.”[8] Geoffrey of Anjou, founder of England’s Plantagenet dynasty, traced his ancestry to Adelais and Ingelger.
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adelais_of_Amboise
     Family Members
     Spouse
      Ingelger of Anjou 850–888
     Children
      Fulk I de Anjou
     BURIAL     Basilique de St-Martin, Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France
     Created by: Our Family History
     Added: 26 Apr 2018
     Find A Grave Memorial 189183095.8
     GAV-30 EDV-30 GKJ-31.

Reference: Genealogics cites: The Lineage and Ancestry of H.R.H. Prince Charles, Prince of Wales, Edinburgh, 1977, Paget, Gerald. 139.10


AelindeAdelaide d'Amboise
Adelais/Aelinde/Rescinde d'Amboise (*ca 844), niece of Adalhard, Bp of Tours and of Raino, Bp of Angers.1 AelindeAdelaide d'Amboise was also known as Adele de Buzancais.6 AelindeAdelaide d'Amboise was also known as Adele de Gatinais.

AelindeAdelaide d'Amboise
niece of Adalhard, bishop of Tours, and of Raino, bishop of Angers.6

Citations

  1. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, online http://genealogy.euweb.cz/index.html, unknown author (e-mail address), downloaded updated 15 May 2003, Anjou 1 page (The House of Anjou): http://genealogy.euweb.cz/anjou/anjou1.html#Erm
  2. [S1490] Genealogics Website (oiginated by Leo van de Pas, continued by Ian Fettes), online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Geoffroy I, Comte de Gâtinais: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020233&tree=LEO. Hereinafter cited as Genealogics Website.
  3. [S630] Unknown author, Broderbund WFT Vol. 2, Ed. 1, Tree #1822, Date of Import: 27 Jul 1997 (n.p.: n.pub., unknown publish date).
  4. [S628] Inc. Br²derbund Software, World Family Tree Vol. 19, Ed. 1, Family 0671 (n.p.: Release date: March 13, 1998, unknown publish date).
  5. [S602] Inc. Brøderbund Software, World Family Tree Vol. 14, Ed. 1, Family #2699 (n.p.: Release date: October 20, 1997, unknown publish date).
  6. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Anjou-Gatinais.pdf, p. 3. Hereinafter cited as Racines et Histoire.
  7. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Ingelger, Comte d'Anjou: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020231&tree=LEO
  8. [S2374] Find a Grave, online http://www.findagrave.com/, Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 13 October 2019), memorial page for Adelais of Amboise of Anjou (unknown–unknown), Find A Grave Memorial no. 189183095, citing Basilique de St-Martin, Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France ; Maintained by Our Family History (contributor 47719401), at: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/189183095/adelais-of_anjou. Hereinafter cited as Find a Grave.
  9. [S2374] Find a Grave, online http://www.findagrave.com/, Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 13 October 2019), memorial page for Ingelger of Anjou (850–888), Find A Grave Memorial no. 144253898, citing Basilique de St-Martin, Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France ; Maintained by Angie Swann (contributor 48313732), at: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/144253898/ingelger_of-anjou
  10. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Aelinde: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020232&tree=LEO

Tertulle/Foulques (?) comte d'Anjou1,2

M, #4845, d. 870
FatherTorquat (?) de Rennes, Count of Bourges & Nevers1,2,3 b. 823, d. 870
ReferenceGAV31 EDV31
Last Edited13 Oct 2019
     Tertulle/Foulques (?) comte d'Anjou married Peronelle/Petronilla (?) D'Auxerre, Countess of Anjou, daughter of Hugo Abbas (?) Archbishop of Koln; Cte d'Auxerre, de Tours et d'Angers, Margrave of Neustria.1,2,3
Tertulle/Foulques (?) comte d'Anjou was buried in 870 at Basilique de St-Martin, Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France (now),

; From Find A Grave:
     BIRTH     unknown, Rennes, Departement d'Ille-et-Vilaine, Bretagne, France
     DEATH     unknown, Fontainebleau, Departement de Seine-et-Marne, Île-de-France, France
     Son of Torquatius of Reims. , b. 823 in Rennes, Bretagne, France; d. 870 in Chateau Landon, Fontainebleau, Seine Et Marne,Ile De France,France. m. 844 Petronelle d'Auxerre, Countess of Anjou. Daughter of Hugo "l'abbe" Capet. Tertullus & Petronelle had one child: Ingelger. According to the legend, Tertulf was a hunter and outlaw who lived in the woods. At the time the Danes were ravaging France, he joined Charles the Bald in defending France against the Norsemen. He was rewarded with land.
     Family Members
     Parents
      Torquatius Of Reims 823–870
     Spouse
      Petronelle d'Auxerre d'Anjou
     Children
      Ingelger of Anjou 850–888
     BURIAL     Basilique de St-Martin, Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France
     Created by: Angie Swann
     Added: 12 May 2015
     Find A Grave Memorial 146406423.3
Tertulle/Foulques (?) comte d'Anjou died in 870 at Chateau Landon, Fontainebleau, Departement de Seine-et-Marne, Île-de-France, France.3
     GAV-31 EDV-31 GKJ-32.

Tertulle/Foulques (?) comte d'Anjou
One Tertulle (Ct of Anjou), fl 821 (maybe a son of Torquat/Tortulfe de Rennes); m.Petronilla de France (*825), possible dau.of Hugo "Le Abbe", illegitimate son of Charlemagne.1 Tertulle/Foulques (?) comte d'Anjou was also known as Tertullus (?) de Gâtinais.3

Tertulle/Foulques (?) comte d'Anjou
per WFT L1-0021: "Seneschal Of The Gatinais."4 He was living in 821.1,2

Citations

  1. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, online http://genealogy.euweb.cz/index.html, unknown author (e-mail address), downloaded updated 15 May 2003, Anjou 1 page (The House of Anjou): http://genealogy.euweb.cz/anjou/anjou1.html#Erm
  2. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Anjou-Gatinais.pdf, p. 3. Hereinafter cited as Racines et Histoire.
  3. [S2374] Find a Grave, online http://www.findagrave.com/, Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 13 October 2019), memorial page for Tertullus De GâTinais (unknown–unknown), Find A Grave Memorial no. 146406423, citing Basilique de St-Martin, Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France ; Maintained by Angie Swann (contributor 48313732): at: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/146406423/tertullus-de_g_tinais. Hereinafter cited as Find a Grave.
  4. [S616] Inc. Br²derbund Software, GEDCOM file imported on 26 Dec 1999 from World Family Tree Vol. 18, Ed. 1, Family #18-0770 (n.p.: Release date: March 27, 1998, unknown publish date).
  5. [S2374] Find a Grave, online http://www.findagrave.com/, Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 13 October 2019), memorial page for Ingelger of Anjou (850–888), Find A Grave Memorial no. 144253898, citing Basilique de St-Martin, Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France ; Maintained by Angie Swann (contributor 48313732), at: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/144253898/ingelger_of-anjou

Peronelle/Petronilla (?) D'Auxerre, Countess of Anjou1,2

F, #4846, b. circa 825
FatherHugo Abbas (?) Archbishop of Koln; Cte d'Auxerre, de Tours et d'Angers, Margrave of Neustria d. 12 May 886; Genealogy.EU (Anjou 1 page) says "possible daughter of Hugo"1,2,3,4
ReferenceGAV31 EDV31
Last Edited13 Oct 2019
     Peronelle/Petronilla (?) D'Auxerre, Countess of Anjou was born circa 825 at Rheinland-Pfalz, Germany (now).5,2,3 She married Tertulle/Foulques (?) comte d'Anjou, son of Torquat (?) de Rennes, Count of Bourges & Nevers.1,2,6
Peronelle/Petronilla (?) D'Auxerre, Countess of Anjou was buried at Basilique de St-Martin, Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France (now),

; From Find A Grave:
     BIRTH     unknown, Rheinland-Pfalz, Germany
     DEATH     unknown, Angers, Departement de Maine-et-Loire, Pays de la Loire, France
     Birth:
     Death:845
     Countess of Anjou
     Family Members
     Parents
      Hugh Welf unknown–886
     Spouse
      Tertullus De GâTinais
     Children
      Ingelger of Anjou 850–888
     BURIAL     Basilique de St-Martin, Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France
     Created by: Memerizion
     Added: 28 May 2015
     Find A Grave Memorial 147096299.3
     Peronelle/Petronilla (?) D'Auxerre, Countess of Anjou
Per Genealogy.EU: Petronilla de France (*825), possible dau.of Hugo "Le Abbe", illegitimate son of Charlemagne.1 GAV-31 EDV-31 GKJ-32.

Peronelle/Petronilla (?) D'Auxerre, Countess of Anjou
     There is some dispute as to the father of Petronilla/Petronelle who m. Tertulle. Genealogy.EU says that she was the dau. of Hugo "Le Abbe" (Hugo, Abbot of St. Quintin, 802-844), an illeitimate son of Charlemagne (hereinafter Hugo #2). However, Find A Grave's memorial for Petronilla/Petronelle (#147096299) says that her father was Hugo "The Abbot" Welf (unk-886), a son of Conrad I of Auxerre (hereinafter Hugo #2).
     Two articles in Wikipedia on Hugo #1 (Abbot of Saint-Quentin and son of Charlemagne), and Hugo #2 (unk-886) discusses the confusion and assigns Petronilla/Petronelle as the dau. of Hugo #2 and thus granddau. of Conrad I.
Per Wikipedia - Hugo #1:
     Hugh (abbot of Saint-Quentin) - Hugh (802–844) was the illegitimate son of Charlemagne and his concubine Regina, with whom he had one other son: Bishop Drogo of Metz (801–855). Along with Drogo and his illegitimate half-brother Theodoric, Hugh was tonsured and sent from the palace of Aachen to a monastery in 818 by his father's successor, Louis the Pious, following the revolt of King Bernard of Italy.[1] Hugh rose to become abbot of several abbacies: Saint-Quentin (822/23), Lobbes (836), and Saint-Bertin (836). In 834,[1] he was made imperial archchancellor by his half-brother.[2]
     On Louis's death in 840, his sons began to fight over the inheritance. In 841, Hugh sided with his nephew Charles the Bald against Louis and Lothair.[3] In 842, Charles spent Christmas with Hugh at Saint-Quentin on his eastern frontier.[4] Hugh's interventions probably secured Saint-Quentin for Charles's kingdom in the division that came with the Treaty of Verdun (843).[5]
     Hugh was part of the small army which, on its way south to join Charles at Toulouse, was ambushed by Pippin II in the Angoumois on 14 June 844. Hugh was killed by a lance, and according to the anonymous verse lament composed about his death—called the Rhythmus de obitu Hugonis abbatis or Planctus Ugoni abbatis[6]—Charles wept over his body.[7][8]
     Hugh is sometimes confused with Hugh the Abbot, resulting in the erroneous claim that he had a daughter, Petronilla, who married Tertullus of Anjou, the semi-legendary father of Ingelger, first count of Anjou. The late accounts of the Angevin origins actually make Petronilla a kinswoman of Hugh the Abbot, not of Charlemagne's son. (emphasis added)
Notes
1. McKitterick 1983, p. 134.
2. McKitterick 1983, p. 84.
3. Nelson 1992, p. 121.
4. Nelson 1992, p. 131.
5. Nelson 1992, p. 134.
6. MGH, Poetae II, p. 139.
7. Nelson 1992, p. 141.
8. McKitterick 1983, p. 294.
Sources
-- McKitterick, Rosamond (1983). The Frankish Kingdoms under the Carolingians, 751–987. London: Longman.
-- Nelson, J. L. (1992). Charles the Bald. London: Longman.
Per Wikipedia - Hugo #2:
     Hugh the Abbot (died 12 May 886) was a member of the Welf family, a son of Conrad I of Auxerre and Adelaide. After his father's death, his mother apparently married Robert the Strong, the margrave of Neustria. On Robert's death in 866, Hugh became the regent and guardian for Robert's sons, Odo and Robert.
     Hugh entered the monastery and rose to become abbot of Saint-Germain d'Auxerre. Despite his vows, he was no peaceful, contemplative monk but the epitome of the warrior-monk of his age. King Charles the Bald sent him on a military expedition to the Nivernais. One can see in this the clerical tendency to support the reigning dynasty against the great vassals. Hugh welcomed Charles when the king had to flee during an 858 invasion of Louis the German, when his vassals refused him aid and rebelled under Robert the Strong. When Robert regained favour, Hugh was exiled to Lotharingia, where he became archbishop of Cologne (864). He was called back to France soon, however.
     In 866, upon Robert's death, Hugh received all the former's abbacies, including Noirmoutiers and Saint-Martin de Tours, counties, including Tours, and the margraviate between the Seine and the Loire (Neustria). The only lands the sons of Robert inherited were in Beauce and Touraine. Despite being Robert's opponent during his life, after his death Hugh became the guardian of Robert's children. Hugh was endued with great political sense and fought the Vikings vigorously. He was the archchaplain of the royal court and one of the chief ministers of the joint-kings Louis III and Carloman. Hugh tried to maintain the alliance of the related Carolingian monarchs against the Vikings. He united all the Carolingian kingdoms against the usurper Boso of Provence. He supported Charles the Fat on his succession to West Francia in 884, but he died before he could lend aid to the defence of Paris during the siege of 885–86.
Sources
-- MacLean, Simon. Kingship and Politics in the Late Ninth Century: Charles the Fat and the end of the Carolingian Empire. Cambridge University Press: 2003.1,7,8,3,9,10

Family

Tertulle/Foulques (?) comte d'Anjou d. 870
Child

Citations

  1. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, online http://genealogy.euweb.cz/index.html, unknown author (e-mail address), downloaded updated 15 May 2003, Anjou 1 page (The House of Anjou): http://genealogy.euweb.cz/anjou/anjou1.html#Erm
  2. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Anjou-Gatinais.pdf, p. 3. Hereinafter cited as Racines et Histoire.
  3. [S2374] Find a Grave, online http://www.findagrave.com/, Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 13 October 2019), memorial page for Petronelle d'Auxerre d'Anjou (unknown–unknown), Find A Grave Memorial no. 147096299, citing Basilique de St-Martin, Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France ; Maintained by Memerizion (contributor 48072664), at: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/147096299/petronelle-d_anjou. Hereinafter cited as Find a Grave.
  4. [S1953] Wikipedia: The Free Encyclopedia, online http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hugh_the_Abbot. Hereinafter cited as Wikipedia.
  5. [S602] Inc. Brøderbund Software, World Family Tree Vol. 14, Ed. 1, Family #2699 (n.p.: Release date: October 20, 1997, unknown publish date).
  6. [S2374] Find a Grave, online http://www.findagrave.com/, Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 13 October 2019), memorial page for Tertullus De GâTinais (unknown–unknown), Find A Grave Memorial no. 146406423, citing Basilique de St-Martin, Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France ; Maintained by Angie Swann (contributor 48313732): at: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/146406423/tertullus-de_g_tinais
  7. [S1490] Genealogics Website (oiginated by Leo van de Pas, continued by Ian Fettes), online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Hugo (#1) - Hugo, Abbot of St.Quintin, Chancellor of Louis the Pious: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020024&tree=LEO. Hereinafter cited as Genealogics Website.
  8. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Hugo (#2) - Hugo, Archbishop of Köln: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020417&tree=LEO
  9. [S1953] Wikipedia, online http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page, Hugo #2: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hugh_the_Abbot
  10. [S1953] Wikipedia, online http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page, Hugo #1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hugh_(abbot_of_Saint-Quentin).
  11. [S2374] Find a Grave, online http://www.findagrave.com/, Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 13 October 2019), memorial page for Ingelger of Anjou (850–888), Find A Grave Memorial no. 144253898, citing Basilique de St-Martin, Tours, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France ; Maintained by Angie Swann (contributor 48313732), at: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/144253898/ingelger_of-anjou

GarnierGardier (?) Seigneur de Loches

M, #4847, b. circa 844, d. 929
FatherAdalard (?) des Loches1 b. 820, d. 864
ReferenceGAV30 EDV30
Last Edited13 Oct 2019
     GarnierGardier (?) Seigneur de Loches married Tescandra (?) des Loches.2 GarnierGardier (?) Seigneur de Loches was born circa 844 at Loches, Departement d'Indre-et-Loire, Centre, France.3
GarnierGardier (?) Seigneur de Loches died in 929.3
     GAV-30 EDV-30 GKJ-31.

GarnierGardier (?) Seigneur de Loches
(an unknown value.)4

Citations

  1. [S2374] Find a Grave, online http://www.findagrave.com/, Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 13 October 2019), memorial page for Adalard des Loches (unknown–unknown), Find A Grave Memorial no. 165391675, ; Maintained by Memerizion (contributor 48072664) Non-Cemetery Burial, at: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/165391675/adalard-des_loches. Hereinafter cited as Find a Grave.
  2. [S2374] Find a Grave, online http://www.findagrave.com/, Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 13 October 2019), memorial page for Tescandra des Loches (unknown–unknown), Find A Grave Memorial no. 147090561, ; Maintained by Memerizion (contributor 48072664) Unknown, at: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/147090561/tescandra-des_loches
  3. [S2374] Find a Grave, online http://www.findagrave.com/, Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 13 October 2019), memorial page for Garnier des Loches (unknown–unknown), Find A Grave Memorial no. 147090669, ; Maintained by Memerizion (contributor 48072664) Unknown, at: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/147090669/garnier-des_loches
  4. [S616] Inc. Br²derbund Software, GEDCOM file imported on 26 Dec 1999 from World Family Tree Vol. 18, Ed. 1, Family #18-0770 (n.p.: Release date: March 27, 1998, unknown publish date).
  5. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, online http://genealogy.euweb.cz/index.html, unknown author (e-mail address), downloaded updated 15 May 2003, Anjou 1 page (The House of Anjou): http://genealogy.euweb.cz/anjou/anjou1.html#Erm
  6. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Anjou-Gatinais.pdf, p. 3. Hereinafter cited as Racines et Histoire.

Robert I (?) de Vermandois, Comte de Meaux et Troyes1,2,3

M, #4848, b. between 910 and 915, d. 19 August 968
FatherHeribert II (?) Cte de Vermandois et de Troyes4,5,6,7,8,9 b. bt 879 - 880, d. 23 Feb 943
MotherAdela/Hildebrante/Liegarde (?) of Neustria, Princess of France3,5,9 b. c 895, d. a 931
ReferenceGAV28
Last Edited3 May 2020
     Robert I (?) de Vermandois, Comte de Meaux et Troyes was born between 910 and 915 at Vermandois, Normandy, France.5 He married Adelais/Adelheid/Wera (?) de Bourgogne, Heiress of Troyes, daughter of Giselbert (?) Duc de Bourgogne, Comte de Châlons sur Saône and Ermengarde (?) Css d'Autun, circa 950 at France.3,8,5,9,10,11
Robert I (?) de Vermandois, Comte de Meaux et Troyes died on 19 August 968; Genealogy.EU (Carolin 1 page) says d. 29 Aug 968.3,5
     Robert I (?) de Vermandois, Comte de Meaux et Troyes
Per Med Lands:
     "ROBERT de Vermandois, son of HERIBERT [II] Comte de Vermandois & his wife Adela [Capet] (-after 19 Jun 966). "Rodberti filium Heriberti comitis" witnessed a charter of "Gauzfredus comes" dated Jul 940[20]. Under the division of the territories organised subsequent to his father's death in 943, Robert became Comte de Meaux. He became Comte de Troyes in 956 on the death of his father-in-law, by right of his wife. Richer names "Robertus Trecarum princeps, Heriberti tiranni filius, Hugonis vero abdicate frater" when recording his rebellion against King Lothaire and capture of Dijon in 959[21]. The Chronicon Sancti Petri Vivi Senonensis records that “Rotbertum comitem” expelled “Ansegisum Trecarum Episcopus” who sought refuge “in Saxoniam ad Ottonem Imperatorem”, dated to 959[22]. Otto I King of Germany sent his son Bruno to besiege Troyes, and King Lothar attacked Dijon which capitulated in 960[23]. "Gaufridus…Andecavorum comes" issued a charter dated 19 Jun 966 subscribed by "Roberti comitis Trecassinorum…"[24].
     "m (before 950) [as her first husband,] ADELAIS [Wera], daughter of GISELBERT Duc des Bourguignons, Comte de Chalon-sur-Saône et de Troyes & his wife Ermengarde [of Burgundy] ([930/35]-after Aug 967). "Trecassine urbis comitem Robertum" donated land to "Gratianum abbatem monasterii Sancti Petri Dervensis" by charter dated 6 Aug 959, signed by "Adelais comitisse, Erberti filii eorum, Walterii vicecomitis"[25]. The Chronicon of Odorannus records the death in 956 of “Gislebertus comes Burgundionem”, adding that “honorem eius cum filia...Leudegarde...” was received by “Otho frater Hugonis ducis” and that “aliam...filiam...Werram” married “Robertus comes Trecasinorum”[26]. It is unclear why these two sources refer to the wife of Comte Robert by different names, as "Adelais comitisse" who signed the 959 charter must have been the same person as the wife of Robert named in 956 because the former document also refers to "Erberti filii eorum". It is possible that the reference to "Werram" is a transcription error as no other reference to this name has been found in other contemporary French sources. Her birth date range is estimated from her own daughter's estimated birth date of [950]."
Med lands cites:
[20] Cluny, Tome I, 511, p. 496.
[21] Richer III.XI, p. 12.
[22] Chronicon Sancti Petri Vivi Senonensis, Spicilegium II, p. 470.
[23] Settipani (1993), p. 231.
[24] Angers Saint-Aubin, 2, p. 4.
[25] Montiéramey 14, p. 19.
[26] Odoranni monachi Sancti Petri Vivi Senonensis Chronicon, Patrologia Latina, Vol. 142, col. 772.9


Robert I (?) de Vermandois, Comte de Meaux et Troyes
Per The Henry Project: Robert
     "Count of Meaux, 946-after 966.
     "Count of Troyes, 956-after 966.
     "Robert first appears as a witness in a 940 charter of count Geoffroy of Nevers ["S. Rodberti, filium Heriberti comitis." Cart. Cluny 1: 496, n. 1]. When his father's lands were partitioned in 946, he received Meaux as his share. As was shown by Karl Ferdinand Werner, Robert became count of Troyes by right of his wife, and not of his father, as had been previously believed [Werner (1960), 107-115]. He evidently became count of Troyes on the death of his father-in-law Giselbert in 956, and is first mentioned with that title on 6 August 959, when he appears with his wife and young son Heribert ["Placuit atque convenit inter gloriosum Trecassine urbis comitem Robertum et Gratianum abbatem monasterii sancti Petri Dervensis... Signum Rotberti, gloriosissimi comitis. S. Adelais comitisse. S. Erberti filii eorum. ..." Cart. Montiéramey, 19 (#14); see also Lot (1901), 269; Werner (1960), 112]. He was still alive on 19 June 966, when he is found witnessing a charter of his son-in-law, count Geoffroy Grisegonelle of Anjou ["S. Roberti comitis Trecassinorum." Cart. S.-Aubin 7]. He probably died not long afterward, succeeded by his brother Heribert "vetulus" and eventually by his son Heribert "juvenis".
     "Date of Birth: Unknown.
     "Place of Birth: Unknown.
     "Date of Death: After 19 June 966. He was still living on 19 June 966. The death date of August 968 given by Arbois de Jubainville [Arbois de Jubainville (1859-66), 1: 141] depends on his dubious identification as the father of Archambaud, archbishop of Sens, and on an incorrect placement of the death date of Archambaud in 968 (see below).
     "Place of Death: Unknown.
     "Father: Heribert II, d. 943, count of Meaux, Soissons, and Vermandois, and abbot of Saint-Crépin and Saint-Médard (Soissons).
     "Mother: NN, daughter of Robert I, king of France. See the page of Heribert II: http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/prov/herib002.htm
     "Spouse: m. 11 December 942 × 18 June 950, Adélaïde alias Werra, d. after 967, daughter of Giselbert, duke of Burgundy. ["Et Gislebertus Comes Burgundionum obiit: et honorem ejus cum filia, nomine Leudegarde, ex qua postea a Radulpho Divionensi Pipicus factus, Otho frater Hugonis Ducis recepit: aliam vero filiam, nomine Werram, duxit in matrimonium Robertus comes Trecassinorum." Ex Chronico Odorannus, RHF 8: 237.] Adélaïde appears in a charter with her parents on 11 December 942 ["S. Giselberti comitis ... S. Ermengardis, que consensit, Adaleidis filie eorum ..." Werner (1960), 112, n. 95]. Robert appears as a witness to a charter of Giselbert dated between 19 June 949 and 18 June 950 [Werner (1960), 111 & n. 89]. She evidently survived her husband, and appears with Robert's brother count Heribert in a fragment of the cartulary of Montiéramey ["... S. Adeleidae comitissae, S. Ettini, S. Eriberti comitis ..." Werner (1960), 112-3, n. 95]
Children:
     "MALE Heribert "juvenus", d. 28 January 995 or 996, count of Meaux and Troyes, 980×4-995×6.
     "FEMALE Adèle, living 6 March 974, m. ca. 965, Geoffroy I "Grisegonelle", d. 987, count of Anjou. For details, see Adèle's page.
Commentary
Conjectured daughter:
     "FEMALE NN, m. Charles, duke of Lorraine. This conjecture is based on a passage in Historia Francorum Senonensis, which states that Charles married a daughter of count Heribert of Troyes ["Cui successit Karolus, frater eius, filius Hlotharii regis. Eodem anno rebellavit contra Karolum Hugo dux Francorum, eo quod accepisset Karolus filiam Herberti comitis Trecarum." Historia Francorum Senonensis, MGH SS 9: 367-8]. Here, Charles is falsely made into a son of king Lothair, when he was in fact a brother. For chronological reasons, Settipani conjectures that she was instead a daughter of Robert [Settipani (1993), 337-8, n. 1010].

Supposed son (doubtful):
     "MALE Archambaud, d. 29 August 967, archbishop of Sens, 958-967. This supposed son has been assigned to Robert by a number of sources [e.g., GC 12: 30-1; Arbois de Jubainville (1859-66), 1: 141-2, 145-7; Lot (1891), 28, n. 3; Brandenburg (1964)], based on a statement of Clarius de Sens that Archambaud's father, a certain Robert, vir nobilis et dives valde, died in the same month that Archambaud died ["In ipso anno, mense Augusto, obiit pater ipsius, Rotbertus nomine, vir nobilis et dives valde. Ipse vero Archembaldus, eodem mense, obiit adhuc juvenis, IIII Kal. Septembris, expletis in episcopatu annis VIIII, et duobus mensibus, et die uno." Clarius de Sens, Chronicon Sancti-Petri-Vivi Senonensis, Bib. Hist. Yonne, 2: 488]. Since Archambaud's father Robert is not clearly identified, the suggestion that he was the same person as Robert of Troyes is uncertain at best. Neither Werner nor Settipani include Archambaud among Robert's children [Werner (1967), 474, where he points out that the names Archambaud and Robert appeared among the lords of Sully; Settipani (1993), 232, n. 303]. For 967 (rather than 968) as the correct year of Archambaud's death, see Lot (1891), 335-6.

Falsely attributed second wife: Ingeltrude.
     "This error is based on a charter of June 960, in which a "count" Robert and his wife Ingeltrude appear witnessing a charter of Frotgaire, bishop of Chalon ["S. Frotgarii episcopi et Rotberti comitis et uxore sua Ingeltrudis. S. Lamberti, comitis, qui consensit." Cart. S.-Marcel-lès-Chalon, 87-8 (#104)]. This Robert has been identified by some with Robert of Troyes [Arbois de Jubainville (1859-66), 1: 142; Brandenburg (1964), 90], but he was in fact a different Robert, a viscount of Dijon of that name [see Lot (1891), 326-7; Werner (1967), 462]. Robert and Ingeltrude were the parents of Lambert, count of Chalon. The editor of the cartulary notes that the title of count given to Robert in this charter was probably a copying error [Cart. S.-Marcel-lès-Chalon, 88, n. 1].

Falsely attributed daughter:
     "FEMALE Adélaïde, m. (1) Lambert, d. probably 978, count of Chalon; (2) Geoffroy I "Grisegonelle", d. 987, count of Anjou. [Arbois de Jubainville (1859-66), 1: 140, 142; Kalckstein (1877), 302 & n. 2; Vajay (1962), 159] This scenario is not feasible [see Lot (1891), 323-6]. Adélaïde, second wife of Geoffroy "Grisegonelle", should not be confused with Geoffroy's first wife Adèle (above), who was in fact a daughter of Robert.

Bibliography
** Arbois de Jubainville (1859-66) = H. d'Arbois de Jubainville, Histoire des ducs et des comtes de Champagne, 6 vols. (Paris, 1859-1866).
** Bib. Hist. Yonne = Louis-Maximilien Duru, ed., Bibliothèque historique de l'Yonne, 2 vols. (Auxerre & Paris, 1850-63).
** Brandenburg (1964) = Erich Brandenburg, Die Nachkommen Karls des Großen (Frankfurt, 1964).
** Cart. Cluny = A. Bernard & A. Bruel, Recueil des chartes de l'abbaye de Cluny, 6 vols., (Paris, 1876-1903).
** Cart. Montiéramey = Charles Lalore, ed., Cartulaire de l'abbaye de Montiéramey (Collection des principaux cartulaires du diocèse de Troyes, 7, Paris & Troyes, 1890).
** Cart. S.-Aubin = Bertrand de Broussillon, Cartulaire de l'abbaye de Saint-Aubin d'Angers, 3 vols. (Angers, 1903).
** GC = Gallia Christiana.
** Kalckstein (1877) = Carl von Kalckstein, Geschichte des französischen Königthums unter den ersten Capetingern (Leipzig, 1877).
** Lot (1891) = Ferdinand Lot, Les derniers Carolingiens (Paris, 1891).
** Lot (1901) = Ferdinand Lot, "Herbert le Jeune et la succession des comtés champenois", Annales de l'Est 15 (1901), 265-283.
** MGH SS = Monumenta Germaniae Historica, Scriptores series.
** RHF = Recueil des historiens des Gaules et de la France.
** Settipani (1993) = Christian Settipani, La préhistoire des Capétiens 481-987 (Première partie - Mérovingiens, Carolingiens et Robertiens) (Villeneuve d'Ascq, 1993).
** Vajay (1962) = Szabolcs de Vajay, "A propos de la 'Guerre de Bourgogne' - Note sur les successions de Bourgogne et de Mâcon au Xe et XIe siècles", Annales de Bourgogne 34 (1962): 153-169.
** Werner (1960) = Karl Ferdinand Werner, "Untersuchungen zur Frühzeit des französischen Fürstentums (9.-10. Jahrhundert): V. Zur Geschichte des Hauses Vermandois", Die Welt als Geschichte 20 (1960): 87-119.
** Werner (1967) = Karl Ferdinand Werner, "Die Nachkommen Karls des Großen bis um das Jahr 1000 (1.-8. Generation)", Karl der Große 4 (1967): 403-483.
Compiled by Stewart Baldwin
     "First uploaded 23 May 2007.
     "Revised version uploaded 24 April 2008 (Added information on two supposed children Adélaïde and Archembaud, plus additional minor corrections.)8"

Robert I (?) de Vermandois, Comte de Meaux et Troyes
Per Genealogics: "Robert was born between 910 and 915, the son of Heribert II, comte de Meaux, Soissons et Vermandois, and Adela of Neustria. Mentioned in documents from 940, Robert obtained the county of Meaux in the partition of his father's lands in 946, three years after his death. By his marriage about 950 to Adelheid de Bourgogne, heiress of Troyes, daughter of Giselbert, duc de Bourgogne, comte de Châlons sur Saône, and Ermengard de Autun, he received the county of Troyes. The union of these two counties was the origin of the county of Champagne. In 959 Robert captured the city of Dijon and drove out the bishop, but he was attacked in 960 by Lothar I, king of France, and Emperor Otto I 'the Great', and had to submit. Robert and Adelheid had a son Heribert and daughter Adelais. Only Adelais would have progeny, marrying Geoffrey I, comte d'Anjou. Robert died on 19 August 967, and was succeeded by Heribert."5

Reference: Genealogics cites: Caroli Magni Progenies, Neustadt an der Aisch, 1977 , Rösch, Siegfried. 148.5


Robert I (?) de Vermandois, Comte de Meaux et Troyes
Per Wikipedia:
     "Robert of Vermandois (c.?907 – c.?967/8) was Count of Meaux and Count of Troyes, succeeding his father, Herbert II, Count of Vermandois and his wife, Adele (Liégarde) of France[1], daughter of Robert I of France.[2] Paternal descent of Pepin of Italy, son of Charlemagne.
     "He was married to Adelais (914–967) of Burgundy, daughter of Giselbert, Duke of Burgundy. They had two children:
** Herbert III, Count of Meaux (c.?935 – 995)
** Adele of Meaux (c.?935 – c.?982)[1][Note 1]

Notes
1. According to Bachrach, Fulk Nerra, the Neo-Roman Consul, pages 9, 273, Adele's father was Herbert II, Count of Vermandois.
References
1. Detlev Schwennicke, Europäische Stammtafeln: Stammtafeln zur Geschichte der Europäischen Staaten, Neue Folge, Band III Teilband 1 (Marburg, Germany: J. A. Stargardt, 1984), Tafel 49.
2. The Annals of Flodoard of Reims, 919–966, eds. Steven Fanning; Bernard S. Bachrach (Toronto: University of Toronto Press Inc., 2011), p. 21 n. 77"

Per Wikipédia (Fr.):
     "Robert Ier de Vermandois1, né avant 920, mort en 29 août 966, fut comte de Meaux de 946 à 966 et de Troyes de 956 à 966. Il était fils d'Herbert II, comte de Vermandois, et d'Adèle de France.
     "Cité dès 940, il n'obtient le comté de Meaux qu'au moment du partage des terres de son père, en 946, c’est-à-dire trois ans après sa mort. Par mariage il reçoit le comté de Troyes, l'union de ces deux comtés étant à l'origine du comté de Champagne. En 959, il s'empare de la ville de Dijon et en chasse l'évêque, mais il est attaqué en 960 par les rois Lothaire de France et Otton de Germanie et doit se soumettre.
Mariage et enfants
     "Il avait épousé peu avant 950 Adélaïde, dite Werra, fille de Gilbert, comte principal des Bourguignons, de Châlon, de Beaune, d'Autun, de Troyes et de Dijon, et d'Ermengarde. Ils avaient eu :
** Herbert IV (v.950 mort en 995 ou 996), comte de Meaux, de Troyes et d'Omois
** Adèle (v.950 morte en 974), mariée vers 965 avec Geoffroy Ier Grisegonelle (mort en 987), comte d'Anjou
** D'après Christian Settipani, Adelais de Troyes2, mariée vers 970 avec Charles, duc de Basse-Lotharingie.

     "Adèle a longtemps été considérée comme la sœur de Robert, mais les éléments qui aboutissaient à cette conclusion se sont révélés insuffisants. Dernièrement, l'historien Karl Ferdinand Werner a montré qu'Adèle était plutôt la fille de Robert.
Notes et références
1. (en) Généalogie de Robert de Vermandois [archive] sur le site Medieval Lands
2. Adelais de Troyes sur le site Foundation for Medieval Genealogy [archive]
Source
** Christian Settipani, La Préhistoire des Capétiens (Nouvelle histoire généalogique de l'auguste maison de France, vol. 1), Villeneuve-d'Ascq, éd. Patrick van Kerrebrouck, 1993, 545 p. (ISBN 978-2-95015-093-6.)12,13" GAV-28.

Robert I (?) de Vermandois, Comte de Meaux et Troyes and Adelais/Adelheid/Wera (?) de Bourgogne, Heiress of Troyes
Per Genealogy.EU: "F6. Cte Robert de Vermandois, Cte de Meaux et Troyes, *ca 918, +29.8.968; m.by 950 Adelais (Wera) de Vergy (*914 +967), dau.of Giselbert of Burgundy."14

Robert I (?) de Vermandois, Comte de Meaux et Troyes and Adelais/Adelheid/Wera (?) de Bourgogne, Heiress of Troyes
Per Racines et Histoire: "Robert de Meaux ° ~918 + 29/08/967/68 comte de Meaux et Troyes (956)
     ép. ~950 Adélaïde Werra de Vergy ° 914 + 967 (fille de Giselbert de Chalon.)15" Robert I (?) de Vermandois, Comte de Meaux et Troyes was Comte de Meaux between 946 and 967.8,12 He was Comte de Troyes (jure uxoris) between 956 and 966.8,5

Citations

  1. [S752] Marcellus Donald Alexander R. von Redlich, compiler, Pedigrees of Some of the Emperor Charlemagne's Descendants, Vol. I (Baltimore: Genealogical Publishing Co., Inc., 1941 (1988 reprint)), p. 269. Hereinafter cited as Charlemagne's Descendants, Vol. I.
  2. [S1490] Genealogics Website (oiginated by Leo van de Pas, continued by Ian Fettes), online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Robert de Vermandois: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020191&tree=LEO. Hereinafter cited as Genealogics Website.
  3. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, online http://genealogy.euweb.cz/index.html, unknown author (e-mail address), downloaded updated 15 May 2003, Carolin 1 page: http://genealogy.euweb.cz/carolin/carolin1.html
  4. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, updated 15 May 2003, Carolin 1 page: http://genealogy.euweb.cz/carolin/carolin1.html
  5. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Robert de Vermandois: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020191&tree=LEO
  6. [S1702] The Henry Project: The ancestors of king Henry II of England, An experiment in cooperative medieval genealogy on the internet, online http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/henry.htm, Heribert II: http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/prov/herib002.htm. Hereinafter cited as The Henry Project.
  7. [S2203] Foundation for Medieval Genealogy (FMG): MEDIEVAL LANDS - A prosopography of medieval European noble and royal families, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/nfravalver.htm#HeribertIIdied943B. Hereinafter cited as FMG Medieval Lands Website.
  8. [S1702] The Henry Project, online http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/henry.htm, Robert: http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/prov/rober005.htm
  9. [S2203] FMG Medieval Lands Website, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/chamtroyes.htm#Robertdied967
  10. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Adelheid|Wera de Bourgogne: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020192&tree=LEO
  11. [S2203] FMG Medieval Lands Website, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/BURGUNDY.htm#AdelaideM1RobertMeauxM2LambertM3Geoffroy
  12. [S1953] Wikipedia: The Free Encyclopedia, online http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_of_Vermandois. Hereinafter cited as Wikipedia.
  13. [S4742] Wikipédia - L'encyclopédie libre, online https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikip%C3%A9dia:Accueil_principal, Robert Ier de Meaux: https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Ier_de_Meaux. Hereinafter cited as Wikipédia (Fr.).
  14. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, updated 15 May 2003, http://genealogy.euweb.cz/carolin/carolin1.html
  15. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, Vermandois, Valois & Vexin, p. 4: http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Vermandois-Valois-Vexin.pdf. Hereinafter cited as Racines et Histoire.
  16. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Adelais de Vermandois: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020194&tree=LEO
  17. [S2203] FMG Medieval Lands Website, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/chamtroyes.htm#ArchambaudSensdied968

Adelais/Adelheid/Wera (?) de Bourgogne, Heiress of Troyes1,2

F, #4849, b. between 930 and 935, d. 19 August 967
FatherGiselbert (?) Duc de Bourgogne, Comte de Châlons sur Saône1,3,4 b. c 890, d. 8 Apr 956
MotherErmengarde (?) Css d'Autun3,4 b. c 893
ReferenceGAV28 EDV29
Last Edited3 May 2020
     Adelais/Adelheid/Wera (?) de Bourgogne, Heiress of Troyes was born between 930 and 935 at Bourgogne, Marneogne, France.1,4 She married Robert I (?) de Vermandois, Comte de Meaux et Troyes, son of Heribert II (?) Cte de Vermandois et de Troyes and Adela/Hildebrante/Liegarde (?) of Neustria, Princess of France, circa 950 at France.1,5,6,7,3,4
Adelais/Adelheid/Wera (?) de Bourgogne, Heiress of Troyes died on 19 August 967.8,9,10,1
     Adelais/Adelheid/Wera (?) de Bourgogne, Heiress of Troyes and Robert I (?) de Vermandois, Comte de Meaux et Troyes
Per Genealogy.EU: "F6. Cte Robert de Vermandois, Cte de Meaux et Troyes, *ca 918, +29.8.968; m.by 950 Adelais (Wera) de Vergy (*914 +967), dau.of Giselbert of Burgundy."11

Adelais/Adelheid/Wera (?) de Bourgogne, Heiress of Troyes and Robert I (?) de Vermandois, Comte de Meaux et Troyes
Per Racines et Histoire: "Robert de Meaux ° ~918 + 29/08/967/68 comte de Meaux et Troyes (956)
     ép. ~950 Adélaïde Werra de Vergy ° 914 + 967 (fille de Giselbert de Chalon.)12" GAV-28 EDV-29 GKJ-29. Adelais/Adelheid/Wera (?) de Bourgogne, Heiress of Troyes was also known as AdelaisAdelaide (?) de Challons, Countess of Vermandois.13 Adelais/Adelheid/Wera (?) de Bourgogne, Heiress of Troyes lived at an unknown place ; Per Med Lands:
     "ADELAIS [Wera] ([930/35]-). "Gislebertus…comes Heduensis" granted property to "suo fidele Guitbaldus…nec non eius coniuge Rutrudis" by charter dated 11 Dec 934, signed by "Gisleberti comitis, Ermengardi, Adaledis filiam eorum…"[74]. The Chronicon of Odorannus records the death in 956 of “Gislebertus comes Burgundionem”, adding that “honorem eius cum filia...Leudegarde...” was received by “Otho frater Hugonis ducis” and that “aliam...filiam...Werram” married “Robertus comes Trecasinorum”[75]. "Trecassine urbis comitem Robertum" donated land to "Gratianum abbatem monasterii Sancti Petri Dervensis" by charter dated 6 Aug 959, signed by "Adelais comitisse, Erberti filii eorum, Walterii vicecomitis"[76]. It is unclear why these two sources refer to the wife of Comte Robert by different names, as "Adelais comitisse" who signed the 959 charter must have been the same person as the wife of Robert named in 956 because the former document also refers to "Erberti filii eorum". It is possible that the reference to "Werram" is a transcription error as no other reference to this name has been found in other contemporary French sources. Her birth date range is estimated from her own daughter's estimated birth date of [950].
     "m (before 950) ROBERT Comte de Meaux, son of HERIBERT II Comte de Vermandois & his wife Adela [Capet] (-after 19 Jun 966). He became Comte de Troyes in 956 on the death of his father-in-law, by right of his wife."
Med lands cites:
[74] Dijon Saint-Etienne, [Tome I], 38, p. 58.
[75] Odoranni monachi Sancti Petri Vivi Senonensis Chronicon, Patrologia Latina, Vol. 142, col. 772.
[76] Montiéramey, 14, p. 19.4


Adelais/Adelheid/Wera (?) de Bourgogne, Heiress of Troyes
Per The Henry Project: Adélaïde alias Werra
     "Wife of Robert, count of Troyes.
     "Adélaïde appears in a charter with her parents on 11 December 942 ["S. Giselberti comitis ... S. Ermengardis, que consensit, Adaleidis filie eorum ..." Werner (1960), 112, n. 95]. Robert appears as a witness to a charter of Giselbert dated between 19 June 949 and 18 June 950 [Werner (1960), 111 & n. 89]. She signed along with her husband Robert and son Heribert in an act at Troyes on 6 August 959 ["Placuit atque convenit inter gloriosum Trecassine urbis comitem Robertum et Gratianum abbatem monasterii sancti Petri Dervensis... Signum Rotberti, gloriosissimi comitis. S. Adelais comitisse. S. Erberti filii eorum. ..." Cart. Montiéramey, 19 (#14); see also Lot (1901), 269; Werner (1960), 112]. She evidently survived her husband, and appears with Robert's brother count Heribert in a fragment of the cartulary of Montiéramey ["... S. Adeleidae comitissae, S. Ettini, S. Eriberti comitis ..." Werner (1960), 112-3, n. 95].
     "The identification as the same person of Adélaïde, daughter of Giselbert of Burgundy in the 942 document, Adélaïde, wife of Robert of Troyes in the 959 document, and Werra, the daughter of Giselbert who married Robert (from Odoran's chronicle, see below) is covered on Giselbert's page.
     "Date of birth: Unknown.
     "Place of birth: Unknown.
     "Date of death: Probably after 19 June 966. She evidently survived her husband, who was still living on 19 June 966.
Place of death: Unknown.
     "Father: Giselbert, d. 8 April 956, duke of Burgundy. ["Et Gislebertus, comes Burgundionum obiit, et honorem ejus cum filia, nomine Leudegarde, ex qua postea a Rodulpho Divionensi pipicus factus, Otho, frater Hugonis ducis recepit. Aliam vero filiam, nomine Werram, duxit in matrimonium Robertus, comes Trecasinorum." Odoran, Chronicon, s.a. 956, Bib. Hist. Yonne, 2: 395 (also RHF 8: 237)]
     "Mother: Ermengarde. She is known from the charter of 11 December 942 (see above).
     "Spouse: m. 11 December 942 × 18 June 950, Robert, d. after 19 June 966; count of Meaux, 946-; count of Troyes, 956-.
     "Children:
     "MALE Heribert "juvenus", d. 28 January 995 or 996, count of Meaux and Troyes, 980×4-995×6.
     "FEMALE Adèle, living 6 March 974, m. ca. 965, Geoffroy I Grisegonelle, d. 987, count of Anjou.
For details, see Adèle's page.

Commentary
Falsely attributed daughter or sister:
Falsely attributed identification:
     "FEMALE Adélaïde, m. (1) Lambert, d. probably 978, count of Chalon; (2) Geoffroy I Grisegonelle, d. 987, count of Anjou.
     "For an account of the confusions which have led to the above problems, see the pages of Adélaïde of Chalon and Giselbert.
     "For some other supposed additional children, see the page of Robert.
Bibliography
** Bib. Hist. Yonne = Louis-Maximilien Duru, ed., Bibliothèque historique de l'Yonne, 2 vols., (Auxerre & Paris, 1850-63).
** Cart. Montiéramey = Charles Lalore, ed., Cartulaire de l'abbaye de Montiéramey (Collection des principaux cartulaires du diocèse de Troyes, 7, Paris & Troyes, 1890).
** Lot (1891) = Ferdinand Lot, Les derniers Carolingiens (Paris, 1891).
** RHF = Recueil des historiens des Gaules et de la France.
** Werner (1960) = Karl Ferdinand Werner, "Untersuchungen zur Frühzeit des französischen Fürstentums (9.-10. Jahrhundert): V. Zur Geschichte des Hauses Vermandois", Die Welt als Geschichte 20 (1960): 87-119.
Compiled by Stewart Baldwin
     "First uploaded 24 April 2008."14

Reference: Genealogics cites:
1. Caroli Magni Progenies, Neustadt an der Aisch, 1977 , Rösch, Siegfried. 148.
2. Europäische Stammtafeln, J.A. Stargardt Verlag, Marburg, Schwennicke, Detlev (Ed.) 3:433.3

Citations

  1. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, online http://genealogy.euweb.cz/index.html, unknown author (e-mail address), downloaded updated 15 May 2003, Carolin 1 page: http://genealogy.euweb.cz/carolin/carolin1.html
  2. [S1490] Genealogics Website (oiginated by Leo van de Pas, continued by Ian Fettes), online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Adelheid/Wera de Bourgogne: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020192&tree=LEO. Hereinafter cited as Genealogics Website.
  3. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Adelheid|Wera de Bourgogne: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020192&tree=LEO
  4. [S2203] Foundation for Medieval Genealogy (FMG): MEDIEVAL LANDS - A prosopography of medieval European noble and royal families, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/BURGUNDY.htm#AdelaideM1RobertMeauxM2LambertM3Geoffroy. Hereinafter cited as FMG Medieval Lands Website.
  5. [S1702] The Henry Project: The ancestors of king Henry II of England, An experiment in cooperative medieval genealogy on the internet, online http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/henry.htm, Robert: http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/prov/rober005.htm. Hereinafter cited as The Henry Project.
  6. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Robert de Vermandois: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020191&tree=LEO
  7. [S2203] FMG Medieval Lands Website, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/chamtroyes.htm#Robertdied967
  8. [S602] Inc. Brøderbund Software, World Family Tree Vol. 14, Ed. 1, Family #2699 (n.p.: Release date: October 20, 1997, unknown publish date).
  9. [S619] Inc. Br²derbund Software, GEDCOM file imported on 27 Dec 1999 from World Family Tree Vol. 6, Ed. 1, Family #6-1556 (n.p.: Release date: August 22, 1996, unknown publish date).
  10. [S640] Inc. Brøderbund Software, World Family Tree Vol. L1, Ed. 1, Family #0021 (n.p.: Release date: October 30, 1998, unknown publish date).
  11. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, updated 15 May 2003, http://genealogy.euweb.cz/carolin/carolin1.html
  12. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, Vermandois, Valois & Vexin, p. 4: http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Vermandois-Valois-Vexin.pdf. Hereinafter cited as Racines et Histoire.
  13. [S752] Marcellus Donald Alexander R. von Redlich, compiler, Pedigrees of Some of the Emperor Charlemagne's Descendants, Vol. I (Baltimore: Genealogical Publishing Co., Inc., 1941 (1988 reprint)), p. 269. Hereinafter cited as Charlemagne's Descendants, Vol. I.
  14. [S1702] The Henry Project, online http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/henry.htm, Adélaïde alias Werra: http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/prov/adela001.htm
  15. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Adelais de Vermandois: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020194&tree=LEO
  16. [S2203] FMG Medieval Lands Website, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/chamtroyes.htm#ArchambaudSensdied968

Heribert II (?) Cte de Vermandois et de Troyes1,2,3

M, #4850, b. between 879 and 880, d. 23 February 943
FatherHeribert I (?) Cte de Vermandois, sn de Senlis, de Peronne et de St.Quentin1,3,4,5 b. bt 840 - 850, d. c 902
ReferenceGAV28 EDV29
Last Edited3 May 2020
     Heribert II (?) Cte de Vermandois et de Troyes was born between 879 and 880 at Vermandois, Normandy, France; Genealogy.EU (Carolin 1 page) says b. 884; Genealogics says b. ca 879; Racines et Histoire says b ca 880; Med Lands says b. 880.6,1,3,7,8 He married Adela/Hildebrante/Liegarde (?) of Neustria, Princess of France, daughter of Robert I (?) Count of Paris, Duke of France, King of the West Franks and Adele/Aélis (?) du Maine, before 21 May 907.6,9,10,8
Heribert II (?) Cte de Vermandois et de Troyes died on 23 February 943 at St. Quentin.6,1,3,11
Heribert II (?) Cte de Vermandois et de Troyes was buried after 23 February 943 at Basilique of Saint Quentin, Saint-Quentin, Departement de l'Aisne, Picardie, France,

; From Find A Grave:
     BIRTH     884, France
     DEATH     943 (aged 58–59)
     Herbert II was born on 884 in Vermandois, Normandy, France and died on February 23, 943 in Aisne, France. He was the Count of Vermandois and Count of Troyes, and was the son of Herbert I of Vermandois.
     He inherited the domain of his father and in 907, added to it the Saint de Soissons abbey. His marriage with Adela of France (also known as Liégarde) brought him the County of Meaux. In 918, he was also named Count of Mézerais and of the Véxin. With his cousin Bernard, Count of Beauvais and Senlis, he constituted a powerful group in the west of France, to the north and east of Paris. In 923, he imprisoned King Charles III in Chateau-Thierry, then in Péronne.
In 922, the Archbishop of Rheims, Seulf, called on Herbert II to reduce some of his vassals who were in rebellion against him. On the death of Seulf, in 925, with the help of King Rudolph, he acquired for his second son Hugh (then five years old) the archbishopric of Rheims, which had a large inheritance in France and Germany. In 926, on the death of Count Roger of Laon, Herbert demanded this County for Eudes, his eldest son. He settled there, initially against the will of King Rudolph and constructed a fortress there. Rudolph yielded to pressure to free king Charles III, whom Herbert still held in prison. In 930, Herbert took the castle of Vitry in Perthois at the expense of Boso, the brother of King Rudolph. Rudolph united his army with the army of Hugh, marquis of Neustria, and in 931, they entered Rheims and defeated Hugh, the son of Herbert. Artaud became the new archbishop of Reims. Herbert II then lost, in three years, Vitry, Laon,
Chateau-Thierry, and Soissons. The intervention of his ally, Henry the Fowler, allowed him to restore his domains (except Rheims and Laon) in exchange for his submission to King Rudolph.
     Later Herbert allied with Hugh the Great and William Longsword,duke of Normandy against King Louis IV, who allocated the County of Laon to Roger II, the son of Roger I, in 941. Herbert and Hugh the Great took back Rheims and captured Artaud. Hugh, the son of Herbert, was restored as archbishop. Again the mediation of the German King Otto I in Visé, near Liège, in 942 allowed for the normalization of the situation.
     Herbert II died on 23 February 943 without having succeeded in building the principality of which he dreamed. His succession was reconciled by Hugh the Great, maternal uncle of his children. It took place in 946 and led to an equitable distribution between the sons of Herbert II: Herbert III, Robert, Adalbert, and Hugh (his other son Eudes died before 946). As for his girls, Adela was married to Arnulf I, count of Flanders, Luitgarde (widow of William Longsword) was married to Theobald I, count of Blois, the first lieutenant of Hugh. She brought to Theobald Provins and domains in the Mézerais.
     Family Members
     Parents
          Herbert I Count of Vermandois unknown–907
          Countess Bertha De Morvois Vermandois unknown–916
     Spouse
          Adele de Capet
     Siblings
          Beatrice of Vermandois
          Espriota Sprota Adela de Bretagne 911–945
     Children
     Adele Of Vermandois
     Adalbert I of Vermandois
     Heribert III de Vermandois
     Robert de Vermandois 910–968
     Luitgardis de Vermandois 914 – unknown
     BURIAL     Basilique of Saint Quentin, Saint-Quentin, Departement de l'Aisne, Picardie, France
     Created by: Kat
     Added: 28 Jun 2011
     Find A Grave Memorial 72159055.12
     Heribert II (?) Cte de Vermandois et de Troyes
Per Genealogy.EU (Carolin 1): "Cte Herbert II de Vermandois et de Troyes, *884, +23.2.943; m.by 907 Adela ? Pss Hildebrante of France (*895 +931.)13"

Heribert II (?) Cte de Vermandois et de Troyes
Per Wikipedia:
     "Herbert II (died 23 February 943), Count of Vermandois, Count of Meaux, and Count of Soissons. He was the first to exercise power over the territory that became the province of Champagne.
Life
     "Herbert was the son of Herbert I of Vermandois.[1] He was apparently well aware of his descent from Charlemagne.[2] Herbert inherited the domain of his father and in 907, added to it the Abbey of St. Medard, Soissons. He took the position of Lay abbot entitling him to the income of those estates.[1] His marriage with a daughter of king Robert I of France brought him the County of Meaux.[3]
     "In 922, when Seulf became Archbishop of Rheims, in an effort to appease Herbert II Seulf solemnly promised him he could nominate his successor.[4] In 923, Count Herbert took the bold step of imprisoning King Charles III, who died still a captive in 929. at an unknown age [3] Then, on the death of Seulf in 925, with the help of King Rudolph, he acquired for his second son Hugh (then five years old) the archbishopric of Rheims.[5] Herbert took the additional step of sending emissaries to Rome to Pope John X to gain his approval, which that pope gave in 926.[4] On his election young Hugh was sent to Auxerre to study.[2]
     "In 926, on the death of Count Roger I of Laon. Herbert demanded this countship for Eudes, his eldest son.[6] He took the town in defiance of King Rudolph leading to a clash between the two in 927.[2] Using the threat of releasing King Charles III, whom he held captive, Herbert managed to hold the city for four more years.[2] But after the death of Charles in 929, Rudolph again attacked Laon in 931 successfully defeating Herbert.[2] The same year the king entered Rheims and defeated archbishop Hugh, the son of Herbert.[7] Artaud became the new archbishop of Reims.[7] Herbert II then lost, in three years, Vitry, Laon, Château-Thierry, and Soissons.[8] The intervention of his ally, Henry the Fowler, allowed him to restore his domains (except Rheims and Laon) in exchange for his submission to King Rudolph.
     "Later Herbert allied with Hugh the Great and William Longsword, duke of Normandy against King Louis IV, who allocated the County of Laon to Roger II, the son of Roger I, in 941. Herbert and Hugh the Great took back Rheims and captured Artaud.[9] Hugh, the son of Herbert, was restored as archbishop.[9] Again the mediation of the German King Otto I in Visé, near Liège, in 942 allowed for the normalization of the situation.
Death and legacy
     "Herbert II died on 23 February 943 at Saint-Quentin, Aisne (the capital of the county of Vermandois).[1] His vast estates and territories were divided among his sons.[10] Vermandois and Amiens went to the two elder sons while Robert and Herbert, the younger sons, were given the valuable holdings scattered throughout Champagne.[10] On Robert's death his brother's son Herbert III inherited them all. Herbert III's only son Stephen died childless in 1019–20 thus ending the male line of Herbert II.[10]
Family
     "Herbert married Adele, daughter of Robert I of France.[11] Together they had the following children:
** Eudes of Vermandois, Count of Amiens and of Vienne, (c.?910–946)[1]
** Adalbert I, Count of Vermandois (c.?915–987), married Gerberge of Lorraine[1]
** Adela of Vermandois (910–960), married 934 Count Arnulf I of Flanders[1]
** Herbert 'the Old' (c.?910–980), Count of Omois, Meaux and Troyes, and abbot of St. Medard, Soissons, married 951 Eadgifu of Wessex daughter of Edward the Elder King of England and widow of Charles III King of France.[b][1]
** Sprota Adele de Senlis (913–945), captive of William I, Duke of Normandy;[1] and fathered Richard I, Duke of Normandy.
** Robert of Vermandois, Count of Meaux and Châlons († 967)[1]
** Luitgarde of Vermandois (c.?915–978), married 940 William I, Duke of Normandy;[1] married secondly, c.?943–44, Theobald I of Blois[c][12] Their son was Odo I, Count of Blois.[10]
** Hugh of Vermandois (920–962), Archbishop of Reims[1]
** Guy I, Count of Soissons (d. 986).[13]
Notes
a. King Charles was the godfather to one of Herbert II's sons. See: Rodulfus Glaber, The Five Books of the Histories, ed. & trans. John France (Oxford: The Clarendon Press, 1989), pp. 12–13 n. 1.
b. Herbert 'the Old', Count of Meux the son of Herbert II is sometimes confused with his nephew, Herbert III, Count of Meux and Troyes, son of Robert Count of Meux. It was Herbert 'the Old' who married Eadgifu of Wessex in 951, his nephew Herbert III wasn't born until c.?950. See ES III/1, 49; K. Norgate, 'Odo of Champagne', EHR 5, 19 (Jul. 1890), 488.
c. It was Hugh the Great who, taking advantage of the youth of Herbert II's successor, gave William Longwsord's widow, Luitgarde to his own vassal Theobald 'the Deceiver', count of Blois. But Glaber mistakenly credited Duke William's murder to Theobald 'the Deceiver' instead of Arnulf of Flanders. See: Rodulfus Glaber, The Five Books of the Histories, ed. & trans. John France (Oxford: The Clarendon Press, 1989), pp. 164–5, n. 2.
References
1. Detlev Schwennicke, Europäische Stammtafeln: Stammtafeln zur Geschichte der Europäischen Staaten, Neue Folge, Band III Teilband 1 (Marburg, Germany: J. A. Stargardt, 1984), Tafel 49
2. Jim Bradbury, The Capetians: Kings of France, 987–1328 (London: Hambledon Continuum, 2007), p. 36
3. Emily Taitz, The Jews of Medieval France: The Community of Champagne (Westport CT: Greenwood Press, 1994), p. 42
4. Eleanor Shipley Duckett, Death and life in the tenth century (Ann Arbor: University of Michigan Press, 1967), p. 155
5. The Annals of Flodoard of Reims, 916–966, eds & trans. Steven Fanning: Bernard S. Bachrach (New York; Ontario, Can: University of Toronto Press, 2011), pp. 14–15
6. The Annals of Flodoard of Reims, 916–966, eds & trans. Steven Fanning: Bernard S. Bachrach (New York; Ontario, Can: University of Toronto Press, 2011), pp. 15–16
7. The Annals of Flodoard of Reims, 916–966, eds & trans. Steven Fanning: Bernard S. Bachrach (New York; Ontario, Can: University of Toronto Press, 2011), p. 21
8. The Annals of Flodoard of Reims, 916–966, eds & trans. Steven Fanning: Bernard S. Bachrach (New York; Ontario, Can: University of Toronto Press, 2011), pp. 20–24
9. Eleanor Shipley Duckett, Death and life in the tenth century (Ann Arbor: University of Michigan Press, 1967), p. 157
10. Kate Norgate, 'Odo of Champagne, Count of Blois and Tyrant of Burgundy', The English Historical Review, Vol. 5, No. 19 (Jul., 1890), p. 488
11. The Annals of Flodoard of Reims, 919–966, eds. Steven Fanning; Bernard S. Bachrach (Toronto: University of Toronto Press Inc., 2011), p. 21 n. 77
12. Detlev Schwennicke, Europäische Stammtafeln: Stammtafeln zur Geschichte der Europäischen Staaten, Neue Folge, Band II (J. A. Stargardt, Marburg, Germany, 1984), Tafel 46
13. Marignan et al. 1906, p. 28.
Sources
** Marignan, Albert; Platon, Jean Georges; Wilmotte, Maurice; Prou, Maurice, eds. (1906). Le Moyen âge (in French). Librairie Ancienne Honore Champion, Editeur.11

Heribert II (?) Cte de Vermandois et de Troyes
Per The Henry Project:
     "Heribert II, Count of Meaux, Soissons, and Vermandois, and lay-abbot of Saint-Crépin and Saint-Médard (Soissons), 900×7-943.
     "Heribert first appears as lay-abbot of Saint-Médard de Soissons on 6 November 907 ["venerabilis comes Heribertus abba preest" Settipani (1993), 224, n. 231, citing an act of Charles the Simple]. He appears as a witness to a charter of Robert (of Neustria) and his son Hugues on 30 May 914 ["Signum Erberti comitis." Mabille (1871), xcviii-c]. In 923, using false promises of safe conduct, he captured king Charles the Simple ["... et Heribertus comes Bernardum, consobrinum suum, cum aliis legatis consilium quod per illos agebatur, ut fertur, ignorantibus, ad Karolum dirigit: qui ab eisdem sacramentis persuasus, ad Heribertum cum paucis proficiscitur; quique eum in castello suo super Somnam, apud Sanctum Quintinum, suscepit." Flodoard, Annales, s.a. 923, 15], who remained a captive for the rest of his life. Heribert died in 943, and his lands were distributed among his sons in 946 ["Quidam motus inter filios Heriberti comitis agitantur pro hereditatum distributione suarum; qui tamen, Hugone principe avunculo ipsorum mediante, pecantur, divisis sibi, prout eis competens visum est, rebus." Flodoard, Annales, s.a. 946, 100]. See Schwager (1994).
     "Date of Birth: Unknown.
     "Place of Birth: Unknown.
     "[Date of Death: 23 February 943. ["Heribertus comes obiit, quem sepelierunt apud Sanctum Quintinum filii sui..." Flodoard, Annales, s.a. 943, 87] The date of 23 February comes from the necrology of the church of Reims [Longnon (1909), 229, n. 4]
Place of Death: Unknown (buried at Saint-Quentin).
     "Probable father: Heribert I, d. 900×906, count of Vermandois. Although not directly documented, this parentage is very probable. See the page of Heribert I for more details.
     "Mother: Unknown.
     "Spouse: NN, still living 931 [Flodoard, Annales, s.a. 931, 51 (not named)], daughter of Robert I, d. 923, king of France.
This relationship is confirmed by the fact that Hugues the Grand was an avunculus of Heribert's sons, who in turn are called nepotes of Hugues (see the page of this wife for details).
     "Children: Heribert's lands were distributed among his sons in 946 ["Quidam motus inter filios Heriberti comitis agitantur pro hereditatum distributione suarum; qui tamen, Hugone principe avunculo ipsorum mediante, pecantur, divisis sibi, prout eis competens visum est, rebus." Flodoard, Annales s.a. 946, 100]. The children are not listed in any one place in the contemporary sources, but various statements in Flodoard's annals clearly document the five sons and two daughters listed below. Of the children, only Hugues has a well documented approximate birthdate. Depending on whether Hugues was one of the elder or younger children, this has led to varying conjectures for the birthdates for the other children [see, e.g. Werner (1967), table; Bur (1977), 507-513; Schwager (1994), 401-6].
     "MALE Eudes, d. after 19 June 946, count of Vienne and Amiens.
Eudes was apparently the eldest son of Heribert. He first appears in 927, when a quarrel broke out between king Raoul and Heribert, with Heribert wanting the county of Laon for his son Eudes, and the king giving it instead to Roger, son of Roger ["Anno DCCCCXXVII, inter Rodulfum regem et Heribertum comitem, pro Laudunensi comitatu quem Heribertus Odoni, filio suo, dari petebat, concedente illum rege cuidam filiorum Rotgarii, nomine Rotgario, simultas exoritur." Flodoard, Annales, s.a. 927, 37]. In 928, Heribert obtained Vienne for Eudes from king Hugh of Italy, which, however, Charles Constantine was holding in 931 ["Hugo rex, habens colloquium cum Rodulfo, dedit Heriberto comiti provintiam Viennensium vice filii sui Odonis" Flodoard, Annales, s.a. 928, 43; ibid., s.a. 931, 46]. A year after the death of Heribert, in 944, Eudes was holding Amiens, but was driven out by men of the king ["Ambianensem quoque urbem, quam tenebat Odo filius Heriberti, favente Deroldo episcopo, et tradentibus ipsius episcopus fidelibus, domestici regis recipiunt. Ex quibus rebus ita gestis exoritur iterum discordia inter regem et filios Heriberti." Flodoard, Annales, s.a. 944, 91]. Eudes was still alive on 19 June 946, when he witnessed an act of Hugues le Grand [Settipani (1993), 225, n. 245].
     "FEMALE Adèle, d. 960, m. 934 Arnulf I, count of Flanders.
["Arnulfus de Flandris filiam Heriberti, olim sibi juramentis alterutro datis depactam, sumit uxorem." Flodoard, Annales, s.a. 934, 59; "Ipse namque iam predictus comes venerabilis Arnulfus accepit coniugem Adelam, domni Heriberti comitis filiam atque duorum regum, Odonis scilicet atque Rotberti, neptem." Witger, Genealogia Arnulfi comitis, MGH SS 9: 303]
     "MALE Heribert "vetulus" ("the old"), d. 980×4 apparently 30 March [Bur (1977), 114], abbot of Saint-Médard de Soissons; count of Omois;
["Nepotes Hugonis, Heribertus et Rotbertus..." Flodoard, Annales, s.a. 952, 134]
m. 951, Eadgifu, daughter of Eadweard "the Elder", king of Wessex, and widow of Charles III of France.["Ottogeba regina, mater Ludowici regis, egressa Lauduno, conducentibus se quibusdam tam Herberti quam Adalberti, fratris ipsius, hominibus, ad Heribertum proficiscitur; qui suscipiens eam, ducit in conjugem." Flodoard, Annales, s.a. 951, 132]
     "MALE Robert, d. after 19 June 966; count of Meaux, 946-; count of Troyes, 956-;
["Rotbertus, filius Heriberti, se Lothario regi committit." Flodoard, Annales, s.a. 957, 144; "Rotbertus, frater Heriberti..." Flodoard, Annales, s.a. 960, 148]
m. 942×950, Adélaïde (Werra), d. after 967, daughter of Giselbert, count of Chalon and Troyes.
     "MALE Albert (Adalbert), d. 8 September, 987 or after [Bur (1977), 510], count of Vermandois, 946-987;
["Cum quo postquam locutus est Remos revertitur, ubi Adalbertus, filius Heriberti, ad eum veniens, ipsius efficitur." Flodoard, Annales, s.a. 949, 123 (see also, s.a. 951, quoted above)]
m. Gerberge, daughter of Giselbert, duke of Lorriane.
[Dümmler (1876), 246, n. 1; Glocker (1989), 282-3; see the page of Giselbert for details of this marriage]
     "FEMALE Liégard, living 16 August 979 [Bur (1977), 512],
m. (1) ca. 940, Guillaume I, d. 943, duke of Normandy;
m. (2) 943×5, Thibaut I "le Tricheur", d. 16 January 975, count of Blois and Chartres, viscount of Tours.
["Hugo presul assumens secum Teobaldum, sororis suae maritum...", Flodoardi Historia Remensi Ecclesiae, iv, 33, MGH SS 13: 584; "Tetbaldus nempe, patrato scelere, concitus perrexit ad Heribertum, Trecorum comitem, petens ab eo sororem ipsius dari sibi in conjugium, uxorem scilicet predicti Willelmi quem interfecerunt." Rodulfus Glaber iii, 9, 39 (p. 88)] Liégard was still living on 5 February 978, when she appears in a charter of Saint-Pére de Chartres [Cart. Saint-Pére de Chartres 1: 63-5]
     "MALE Hugues, b. ca. 920, d. ca. 962 [Bur (1977), 507], archbishop of Reims, 925-932, 940-6.
His father had him created archbishop of Reims at the age of five ["Episcopatus Remensis Heriberto comiti comissus est sub obtentu filii sui Hugonis, admodum parvuli, necdum, ceu ferebatur, quinqennis." Flodoard, s.a. 925, MGH SS 3: 376].

Commentary
     "Falsely attributed mother (fictional): Berthe, daughter of Guerri (Wedricus), count of Morvois, and his wife Eva. See the page of Heribert I for discussion.
     "Falsely attributed daughter (in fact a granddaughter): FEMALE Adèle, m. Geoffroy Grisegonelle, d. 987, count of Anjou. Although Heribert did have a daughter of this name, she was the wife of Arnulf of Flanders (see above). The Adèle who was wife of Geoffroy Grisegonelle was Heribert's granddaughter, a daughter of his son Robert, as is discussed on Adèle's page.
     "Falsely attributed son: MALE Ragenold/Renaud, d. 10 May 967, count of Roucy. This falsehood appears in amateur work from time to time, due to its appearance in the widely used Ancestral Roots [AR7, 133 (line #151); see the page of Ragenold].
     "Conjectured daughter (very improbable): FEMALE Godehilde, living 1005; m. Yves I, livinf 1005, lord of Bellême. [Depoin (1909), 153-6] Godehilde was almost certainly in a later generation than the children of Heribert.
Bibliography
     "AR7 = Frederick Lewis Weis (with additions and corrections by Walter Lee Sheppard, Jr.), Ancestral Roots of Certain American Colonists Who Came to America before 1700 (7th, ed., Baltimore, 1992).
     "Bur (1977) = Michel Bur, La formation du comté de Champagne (Nancy, 1977).
     "Cart. S.-Père de Chartres = M Guérard, Cartulaire de l'Abbaye de Saint-Père de Chartres, 2 vols. (Paris, 1840).
     "Depoin (1909) = Joseph Depoin, "Les premiers anneaux de la maison de Bellême - Contribution à la chronologie des évèques du Mans", Bulletin Historique et Philologique du Comité des Travaux Historiques et Scientifiques, 1909: 147-167.
     "Dümmler (1876) = Rudolf Köpke & Ernst Dümmler, Kaiser Otto der Große (Leipzig, 1876).
     "Glocker (1989) = Winfrid Glocker, Die Verwandten der Ottonen und ihre Bedeutung in der Politik. Studien zur Familienpolitik und zur Genealogie des sächsischen Kaiserhauses (Cologne-Vienna, 1989).
     "Flodoard, Annales = Ph. Lauer, ed., Les Annales de Flodoard (Paris, 1905).
     "Longnon (1909) = Auguste Longnon, "Nouvelle recherches sur les personnages de Raoul de Cambrai", Romania 38 (1909): 219-253.
     "Lot (1901) = Ferdinand Lot, "Herbert le Jeune et la succession des comtés champenois vers 1023", Annales de l'Est 15 (1901): 265-283.
     "Mabille (1871) = Émile Mabille, Introduction au Chroniques des Comtes d'Anjou (Société de l'Histoire de France, vol. 155, Paris, 1871).
     "Rodulfus Glaber = Maurice Prou, ed., Raoul Glaber - les cinq livres de ses histoires (900-1044) (Paris, 1886).
     "Schwager (1994) = Helmut Schwager, Graf Heribert II. von Soissons, Omois, Meaux, Madrie sowie Vermandois (900/06-943) und die Francia (Nord-Frankreich) in der 1. Hälfte des 10. Jahrhunderts (Münchener historische Studien Abteilung mittelalterliche Geschichte, 6, 1994).
     "Settipani (1993) = Christian Settipani, La préhistoire des Capétiens 481-987 (Première partie - Mérovingiens, Carolingiens et Robertiens) (Villeneuve d'Ascq, 1993).
     "Werner (1967) = Karl Ferdinand Werner, "Die Nachkommen Karls des Großen bis um das Jahr 1000 (1.-8. Generation)", Karl der Große 4 (1967): 403-483.
Compiled by Stewart Baldwin
     "First uploaded 23 May 2007.
     "Note about Ragenold of Roucy added 24 April 2008.
     "Minor revision uploaded 26 July 2008 (discussion of the documentation on his wife moved to the page of that wife)
     "Note about Godehilde added 24 January 2011.14

Heribert II (?) Cte de Vermandois et de Troyes
Per Wikipédia (Fr.):
     "Herbert II, né vers 880, mort le 23 février 943, fut comte de Vermandois, de Soissons et de Meaux à la mort de son père survenue entre 900 et 907.
Biographie
Famille
     "Fils de Herbert Ier mort entre 900 et 907 et de Leutgarde, fille du comte de Troyes Adalelme, Herbert II épousa avant 907, Adèle de France, fille de Robert, marquis de Neustrie et futur roi de France sous le nom de Robert Ier. De cette union naquirent1 :
** Eudes (v.915 † ap.946), comte d'Amiens ;
** Adèle († 960), mariée en 934 à Arnoul Ier (890 † 964), comte de Flandre ;
** Hugues (920 † 962), comte et évêque de Reims ;
** Liutgarde, mariée vers 937 à Guillaume Ier Longue-épée († 942), duc de Normandie, puis vers 943 à Thibaud Ier le Tricheur († 975), comte de Blois ;
** Herbert III dit le Vieux (v. 927 † 982), comte d'Omois ;
** Robert Ier (v. 920 † ap.966), comte de Meaux et de Troyes ;
** Albert Ier (v. 934 † 987), comte de Vermandois.
** et peut-être Guy Ier ( † v. 988), comte de Soissons (969-988).

La capture et la détention du roi Charles le Simple
     "Ayant hérité des biens de son père, il augmente sa puissance territoriale vers le Vexin et la Champagne. En 922, il participe à la révolte des grands du royaume contre le roi de Francie occidentale Charles le Simple qu'il capture par traîtrise en 923. Il le garde prisonnier, et s'en sert comme moyen de pression vis-à-vis du roi Raoul obtenant ainsi de ce dernier le siège archiépiscopal de Reims pour son fils Hugues.
     "En 926, il s'empare d'Amiens. Il obtient le comté de Laon en 928, et y construit une citadelle (château Gaillot), mais doit rendre la ville en 931 et la citadelle en 938. En 931, il se rapproche du roi de Germanie Henri l'Oiseleur, mais se soumet au roi de Francie occidentale en 935. Il intervient ensuite plusieurs fois à Reims pour restaurer son fils.
Une mort tragique
     "Selon Raoul Glaber2 et aussi Dom Le long qui rapporte une tradition locale, il aurait été pendu sur ordre de Louis IV d'Outremer3,4. Après sa mort, ses biens sont partagés entre ses différents fils par son neveu et beau frère, Hugues le Grand, mettant fin ainsi à la puissance vermandoise.
     "Herbert II est décédé le 23 février 943 à Saint-Quentin (Aisne), la capitale du comté de Vermandois. Ses vastes domaines et les territoires ont été répartis entre ses fils.
Tombeau
     "Herbert II de Vermandois fut inhumé dans l'église de la collégiale de Saint-Quentin, "capitale" de ses possessions où il mourut. La collégiale devint une basilique en 1876. En août 1917, les Allemands allumèrent un incendie qui détruisit quasiment toute l’église. La crypte fut minée et sauta. Il ne reste rien de la sépulture de ce prince
Sources et bibliographie
** Christian Settipani, La Préhistoire des Capétiens (Nouvelle histoire généalogique de l'auguste maison de France, vol. 1), Villeneuve-d'Ascq, éd. Patrick van Kerrebrouck, 1993, 545 p. (ISBN 978-2-95015-093-6) Document utilisé pour la rédaction de l’article
** Honoré Fisquet, La France pontificale (Gallia christiana), histoire chronologique et biographique des archevêques et évêques de tous les diocèses de France depuis l'établissement du christianisme jusqu'à nos jours, divisée en 17 provinces ecclésiastiques - Métropole de Reims - Reims, Paris : E. Repos, 1864-1873, pp.53-57 [1] [archive]
Liens internes
Liste des comtes de Vermandois: https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liste_des_comtes_de_Vermandois
Histoire de la Picardie: https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Histoire_de_la_Picardie
Histoire de l'Aisne: https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Histoire_de_l%27Aisne
Histoire de la Somme: https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Histoire_de_la_Somme
Histoire d'Amiens: https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Histoire_d%27Amiens
Notices d'autorité : Fichier d’autorité international virtuelInternational Standard Name IdentifierBibliothèque du CongrèsWorldCat
Notes et références
1. Famille d'Herbert II sur Medieval Lands [archive]
2. Louis-Paul Colliette, Mémoires pour servir à l'histoire ecclésiastique, civile et militaire de la province du Vermandois [archive], Berthoud, 1771, p. 457
3. L'esprit des journaux [archive] J. J. Tutot, 1785, p. 89
4. Philippe Lauer, Le règne de Louis IV d'Outr-mer, É. Bouillon, 1900, p. 292,293."15

Heribert II (?) Cte de Vermandois et de Troyes
Per Med Lands:
     "HERIBERT [II], son of HERIBERT [I] Comte de Vermandois & his wife [Lietgardis] --- ([880]-23 Feb 943, bur Saint Quentin). None of the sources so far consulted state explicitly that Héribert [II] and his sister Beatrix were the children of Héribert [I] but this looks probable. He succeeded his father in [900/907] as Comte de Meaux, de Soissons et de Vermandois. Lay Abbot of St Crépin and St Médard at Soissons. Comte Héribert took part in the rebellion against Charles III “le Simple” King of France in 922 and tricked the ex-king into capture after he fled following his defeat near Soissons in 923. Flodoard records in 923 that "Heribertus comes" sent “Bernardum consobrinum suum” with a delegation “ad Karolum” who was “in castello suo super Somnam apud Sanctum Quintinum”, and who was detained “in...munitionem suam...Castellum Theoderici super Maternam fluvium”[198]. Héribert consolidated his power by arranging for his young son to be made Archbishop of Reims. Comte Héribert received Péronne from Raoul King of France in 924. Together with forces of Arnoul I Count of Flanders, Héribert captured the Viking stronghold of Eu[199]. Following this he apparently forged an alliance with Comte Rollo in [927][200], leaving his son Eudes with Rollo as a hostage. Comte Héribert unsuccessfully attempted to capture Laon in 927[201]. [Comte de Vienne]: Flodoard records that Ugo King of Italy gave "provintiam Viennensem" to Héribert Comte de Varmandois in 928, and that "Odonis filii sui [=Heriberto]" was appointed vicecomes[202]. No primary source has yet been identified which describes Héribert as “Comte de Vienne” or confirms whether he adopted the comital title. Flodoard provides an insight into the continuing rivalries regarding Vienne when he records in 933 that it was granted to "Rodulfo regi" [Rudolf II King of Upper Burgundy, see the document BURGUNDY KINGS][203]. With help from Hugues "le Grand" [Capet], King Raoul subdued Vermandois and Comte Héribert made his submission to the king[204]. In 939. Héribert joined the alliance against Louis IV King of France led by Otto I "der Große" King of Germany, who raided Frankish territory and forced King Louis to renounce his claim to the throne of Lotharingia. Together with Hugues "le Grand" [Capet], Héribert besieged Reims, forcing the restoration of his son as archbishop, and also besieged King Louis at Laon. Flodoard records the death of "Heribertus comes" in 943 and his burial at Saint-Quentin[205]. The necrology of Reims Cathedral records the death "VII Kal Mar" of "Heribertus comes"[206]. On his death in 943, his territories were divided between his sons by their maternal uncle Hugues "le Grand".
     "m (before 21 May 907) [ADELA], daughter of ROBERT Marquis en Neustrie, Comte de Paris [later ROBERT I King of France] & his first wife [Adela] --- (before 898-). The Chronicle of Alberic de Trois-Fontaines refers to "comitis Heriberti gener…Roberti" and in a later passage to the sister of "dux Hugo Cappatus" as the wife of "comitis Heriberti de Peroni, Campanie et Veromandie" but does not name her[207]. Her origin is confirmed by Flodoard naming "Hugo dux cum nepotibus suis, Heriberti filiis" in 943[208]. Her birth date is estimated from the birth of her first child in [915]. Her name is deduced as follows. The 21 May 907 donation of Rebais abbey to the church of Paris refers to "comitis Rotberti et Adele comitisse"[209]. Although this phrasing usually indicates husband and wife, Settipani suggests that the chronology of the life of King Robert's son Hugues (attested as Robert's son by his second wife Béatrix) favours his birth, and therefore his father's second marriage, well before 907, which would mean "Adele" could not have been Robert's wife. This reasoning appears based firstly on Hugues already being married in [914], and secondly on the probability of his having reached the age of majority when he was recognised as duke in 922. The 907 document is explained as referring to Robert and his elder daughter. The issue, however, is not beyond doubt, especially if the document in question was misdated. Her marriage date assumes that this identification is correct.
     "Comte Héribert II & his wife had [eight] children."
Med Lands cites:
[198] Flodoard 923, MGH SS III, p. 372.
[199] Settipani (1993), p. 224.
[200] Annals of Flodoard of Reims, quoted in Houts (2000), p. 45.
[201] McKitterick (1983), p. 312.
[202] Flodoard 928, MGH SS III, p. 378.
[203] Flodoard 933, MGH SS III, p. 381.
[204] McKitterick (1983), p. 312.
[205] Flodoard 943, MGH SS III, p. 389.
[206] 'Obits mémorables tirés de nécrologes luxembourgeois, rémois et messins', Revue Mabillon VI (1910-1911), p. 273.
[207] Chronica Albrici Monachi Trium Fontium 920 and 988, MGH SS XXIII, pp. 756 and 774.
[208] Flodoard 944, MGH SS III, p. 390.
[209] Diplôme de Charles III, no 57, Lauer, quoted in Settipani (1993), p. 407.16


Heribert II (?) Cte de Vermandois et de Troyes
Per Genealogics:
     "Heribert was born about 879, the son of Heribert I, comte de Vermandois, and Bertha de Morvois. He was count of Vermandois and count of Troyes.
     "He inherited the domain of his father and in 907 he added to it the Saint de Soissons abbey. His marriage with Adela (also known as Liégarde) of Neustria brought him the county of Meaux. In 918 he was also named count of Mézerais and of the Véxin. With his cousin Bernhard, count of Beauvais and Senlis, he constituted a powerful group in the west of France, to the north and east of Paris. In 923 he imprisoned King Charles III in Château-Thierry, then in Péronne. He and his wife Adela, daughter of Robert I, king of France, and his wife Aelis, had seven children of whom Adela, Robert, Adalbert and Liutgarde would have progeny.
     "In 922 the archbishop of Reims, Seulf, called on Heribert to reduce some of his vassals who were in rebellion against him. On the death of Seulf in 925, with the help of Raoul, king of France he acquired for his second son Hugues (then five years old) the archbishopric of Reims, which had a large inheritance in France and Germany. In 926, on the death of Roger, count of Laon, Heribert demanded this county for Eudes, his eldest son. He settled there, initially against the will of King Raoul, and constructed a fortress there. Raoul yielded to pressure to free King Charles III 'the Simple', whom Heribert still held in prison.
     "In 930 Heribert took the castle of Vitry-en-Perthois at the expense of Boso, the brother of King Raoul. Raoul united his army with that of Hugues, marquis of Neustria, and in 931 they entered Reims and defeated Hugues, the son of Heribert. Artaud became the new archbishop of Reims. Heribert II then lost, in three years, Vitry, Laon, Château-Thierry and Soissons. The intervention of his ally, Emperor Heinrich I 'the Fowler', allowed him to restore his domains (except Reims and Laon) in exchange for his submission to King Raoul.
     "Later Heribert allied with Hugues 'the Great', duke of the Franks, and Guillaume I 'Longsword', duke of Normandy, against King Louis IV, who allocated the county of Laon to Roger II, the son of Roger I, in 941. Heribert and Hugues 'the Great' took back Reims and captured Artaud. Hugues, the son of Heribert, was restored as archbishop. Again the mediation of the German King Otto I, in Visé near Liège, in 942 allowed for the normalisation of the situation.
     "Heribert II died on 23 February 943 without having succeeded in building the principality of which he dreamed. His succession was reconciled by Hugues 'the Great', maternal uncle of his children. It took place in 946 and led to an equitable distribution between Heribert's sons."3 GAV-28 EDV-29 GKJ-30.

Reference: Genealogics cites:
1. Caroli Magni Progenies Neustadt an der Aisch, 1977. , Siegfried Rosch, Reference: 124.
2. Ancestral Roots of Certain American Colonists who came to Amercia bef.1700 7th Edition, Frederick Lewis Weis, Reference: 51.
3. Biogr. details drawn from Wikipedia.17



Heribert II (?) Cte de Vermandois et de Troyes and Adela/Hildebrante/Liegarde (?) of Neustria, Princess of France
Per Racines et Histoire (Vermandois, p. 8): "Hér(i)bert II de Vermandois ° ~880 + 23/02/943 comte de Meaux, Soissons et Vermandois (900/907), Abbé laïc de Saint-Crépin & de Saint-Médard de Soissons ; rebelle contre le Roi Charles «Le Simple» (922) qu’il emprisonne ; fait élire son fils Archevêque de Reims, reçoit Péronne (924) du Roi ; allié aux Flamands, annexe Eu ; sans doute allié à Rollon (927) ; échoue à prendre Laon (928) ; doit se soumettre au Roi Raoul, allié à Hugues «Le Grand» ; rebelle contre le Roi Louis IV (939) avec Otto «Le Grand» de Germanie (donation avec sa femme de l’Abbaye de Rebais 21/05/907 à l’Eglise de Paris)
     ép. avant 21/05/907 Adela ° avant 898 (fille de Robert, marquis en Neustrie, plus tard Roi de France (Robert 1er),et d’Adela.)7" Heribert II (?) Cte de Vermandois et de Troyes was Comte de Vermandois, de Meaux et de Soissons between 900 and 943.15

Citations

  1. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, online http://genealogy.euweb.cz/index.html, unknown author (e-mail address), downloaded updated 15 May 2003, Carolin 1 page: http://genealogy.euweb.cz/carolin/carolin1.html
  2. [S1490] Genealogics Website (oiginated by Leo van de Pas, continued by Ian Fettes), online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Heribert I: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020187&tree=LEO. Hereinafter cited as Genealogics Website.
  3. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Heribert II: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020189&tree=LEO
  4. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Heribert I: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020187&tree=LEO
  5. [S2203] Foundation for Medieval Genealogy (FMG): MEDIEVAL LANDS - A prosopography of medieval European noble and royal families, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/nfravalver.htm#HeribertIdied900907. Hereinafter cited as FMG Medieval Lands Website.
  6. [S632] Frederick Lewis Weis, Ancestral Roots of Certain American Colonists Who Came to America before 1700: The Lineage of Alfred the Great, Charlemagne, Malcolm of Scotland, Robert the Strong, and Some of Their Descendants, 7th edition (n.p.: Genealogical Publishing Co., Inc.
    Baltimore, 1992, unknown publish date), line 50-18, p. 51. Hereinafter cited as Weis AR-7.
  7. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, Vermandois, Valois & Vexiin, p. 8: http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Vermandois-Valois-Vexin.pdf. Hereinafter cited as Racines et Histoire.
  8. [S2203] FMG Medieval Lands Website, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/CAPET.htm#AdelaMHeribertIIVermandois
  9. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, updated 15 May 2003, Capet 2 page: http://genealogy.euweb.cz/capet/capet2.html
  10. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Adela/Liegarde/Hildebrante of Neustria: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020190&tree=LEO
  11. [S1953] Wikipedia: The Free Encyclopedia, online http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herbert_II,_Count_of_Vermandois. Hereinafter cited as Wikipedia.
  12. [S2374] Find a Grave, online http://www.findagrave.com/, Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 10 November 2019), memorial page for Herbert II Of Vermandois (884–943), Find A Grave Memorial no. 72159055, citing Basilique of Saint Quentin, Saint-Quentin, Departement de l'Aisne, Picardie, France ; Maintained by Kat (contributor 47496397), at: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/72159055/herbert_ii-of_vermandois. Hereinafter cited as Find a Grave.
  13. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, updated 15 May 2003, Carolingians p. 1: http://genealogy.euweb.cz/carolin/carolin1.html
  14. [S1702] The Henry Project: The ancestors of king Henry II of England, An experiment in cooperative medieval genealogy on the internet, online http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/henry.htm, Heribert II: http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/prov/herib002.htm. Hereinafter cited as The Henry Project.
  15. [S4742] Wikipédia - L'encyclopédie libre, online https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikip%C3%A9dia:Accueil_principal, Herbert II de Vermandois: https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herbert_II_de_Vermandois. Hereinafter cited as Wikipédia (Fr.).
  16. [S2203] FMG Medieval Lands Website, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/nfravalver.htm#HeribertIIdied943B
  17. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Heribert II: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020189&tree=LEO
  18. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Archambaud de Vermandois: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00185933&tree=LEO
  19. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Heribert de Vermandois: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00185929&tree=LEO
  20. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Adela de Vermandois: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00018651&tree=LEO
  21. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Flandres.pdf, p. 3.
  22. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Eudes de Vermandois: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00185931&tree=LEO
  23. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, updated 15 May 2003, Carolin 1 page: http://genealogy.euweb.cz/carolin/carolin1.html
  24. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Robert de Vermandois: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020191&tree=LEO
  25. [S1702] The Henry Project, online http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/henry.htm, Robert: http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/prov/rober005.htm
  26. [S2203] FMG Medieval Lands Website, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/chamtroyes.htm#Robertdied967
  27. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Liutgarde/Ledgard de Vermandois: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020498&tree=LEO
  28. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Blois-Champagne.pdf, p. 2.
  29. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Brabant.pdf, p. 3.
  30. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Adalbert 'the Pious': https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020492&tree=LEO
  31. [S2203] FMG Medieval Lands Website, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/nfravalver.htm#AlbertIdied987B
  32. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Hugues de Vermandois: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00185930&tree=LEO

Adela/Hildebrante/Liegarde (?) of Neustria, Princess of France1,2,3

F, #4851, b. circa 895, d. after 931
FatherRobert I (?) Count of Paris, Duke of France, King of the West Franks1,2,4 b. a Sep 866, d. 15 Jun 923
MotherAdele/Aélis (?) du Maine1,2,5,4,6,7 b. 868, d. 894
ReferenceGAV28 EDV29
Last Edited4 May 2020
     Adela/Hildebrante/Liegarde (?) of Neustria, Princess of France was born circa 895 at Vermandois, Normandy, France; Med Lands says b. bef 898.1,4 She married Heribert II (?) Cte de Vermandois et de Troyes, son of Heribert I (?) Cte de Vermandois, sn de Senlis, de Peronne et de St.Quentin, before 21 May 907.8,1,2,4
Adela/Hildebrante/Liegarde (?) of Neustria, Princess of France died after 931 at France; Genealogy.EU & Henry Project say she d. aft 931.1,9
Adela/Hildebrante/Liegarde (?) of Neustria, Princess of France was buried after 931 at Basilique of Saint Quentin, Saint-Quentin, Departement de l'Aisne, Picardie, France,

; From Find A Grave:
     Family Members
     Parents
          Robert Robertin 866–923
          Aélis du Maine 868–894
     Spouse
          Herbert II Of Vermandois 884–943
     Siblings
          Emma de France de Bourgogne
     Half Siblings
          Hugh Robertin unknown–956
     Children
          Adele Of Vermandois
          Robert de Vermandois 910–968
          BURIAL     Basilique of Saint Quentin, Saint-Quentin, Departement de l'Aisne, Picardie, France
     Created by: Memerizion
     Added: 6 Mar 2015
     Find A Grave Memorial 143389983.10
     Adela/Hildebrante/Liegarde (?) of Neustria, Princess of France and Heribert II (?) Cte de Vermandois et de Troyes
Per Racines et Histoire (Vermandois, p. 8): "Hér(i)bert II de Vermandois ° ~880 + 23/02/943 comte de Meaux, Soissons et Vermandois (900/907), Abbé laïc de Saint-Crépin & de Saint-Médard de Soissons ; rebelle contre le Roi Charles «Le Simple» (922) qu’il emprisonne ; fait élire son fils Archevêque de Reims, reçoit Péronne (924) du Roi ; allié aux Flamands, annexe Eu ; sans doute allié à Rollon (927) ; échoue à prendre Laon (928) ; doit se soumettre au Roi Raoul, allié à Hugues «Le Grand» ; rebelle contre le Roi Louis IV (939) avec Otto «Le Grand» de Germanie (donation avec sa femme de l’Abbaye de Rebais 21/05/907 à l’Eglise de Paris)
     ép. avant 21/05/907 Adela ° avant 898 (fille de Robert, marquis en Neustrie, plus tard Roi de France (Robert 1er),et d’Adela.)11"

Adela/Hildebrante/Liegarde (?) of Neustria, Princess of France
Per The Henry Project:
     "NN - Wife of Heribert II, count of Vermandois.
     "Although there is no direct documentation for the name of Heribert's wife, the chronicler Flodoard confirms on several occasions that she was a sister of Hugues the Great, and thus a daughter of Robert I ["... Hugo dux cum nepotibus suis, Heriberti filiis..." Flodoard, Annales, s.a. 943, 88; "... inter filios Heriberti comitis ..., Hugone principe avunculo ipsorum ..." ibid. s.a. 946, 100 (see above); "Nepotes Hugonis, Heribertus et Rotbertus..." ibid., s.a. 952, 134]. Since the sons of Heribert were nepotes of Hugues, and Hugues was avunculus to the sons of Heribert, the clear interpretation is that Heribert was married to a sister of Hugues, and the names of Eudes, Hugues and Robert given to three of the sons of Heribert provide further confirmation. Other sources also mention the connection, sometimes with an ambiguity (involving the words nepos or gener) which may have helped give rise to the evidently false claim that Hugues was a nephew of Heribert [e.g., "Unde et aliorum regnorum proceres eum adierunt, gratiamque in conspectu eius invenire quaerentes, fidem talis ac tanti viri probatam habentes dilexerunt. Inter quos Hiriberhtus gener Hugonis, cum ei adversaretur Rodulfus, contra ius fasque omne rex constitutus, ut ei apud dominum suum pro praesidio esset, supplicavit." Widukind, i, 39, MGH SS 3: 435; "Ductus inde exercitus contra urbem Remensem, ubi erat nepos Hugonis contra ius fasque omne subrogatus episcopus, legitimo pontifice adhuc superstite" Widukind, iii, 3, MGH SS 3: 451 (referring to Hugues, son of Heribert II); "Ipse namque iam predictus comes venerabilis Arnulfus accepit coniugem Adelam, domni Heriberti comitis filiam atque duorum regum, Odonis scilicet atque Rotberti, neptem." Witger, Genealogia Arnulfi comitis, MGH SS 9: 303; "Post cruentissimum vero praelium videns Karolus se adhuc in adversariorum medio positum, hinc scilicet Hugonem, iam dicti Rodberti regis filium, illinc Herebertum, eiusdem generum, cavensque, ne irruerent super eum cum multitudine hostium, reversus est cum suis inde venerat, in Hlotharii regnum." Folcwine, c. 101, MGH SS 13: 625].
     "Although no clear documentation is known for her name, there are three names which have appeared for her in various places in the secondary literature. There is no evidence which would give her the name Hildebrante, as suggested by some sources [e.g. Anselme, 1: 68]. Some have suggested that she was the countess Adèle who appears in a document of 907 with the future king Robert I [e.g., Werner (1967), 458, n. 4; Settipani (1993), 407-8], but it is more likely that this Adèle was a wife of Robert [see the Commentary section of the page of Robert I]. The third name which has been suggested for her is Liégarde [e.g., Depoin (1908), 595-6; Chaume (1925), 392, n. 4; Pinoteau (1958), table between pp. 256-7]. This is based on the appearance of that name among her children and on the appearance in the necrology of Saint-Quentin under 26 May of an otherwise unidentified countess Liégarde who would probably be connected somehow to the counts of Vermandois ["VII Kal. jun. Obiit Lieuardis comittissa" Chaume (1925), 392, n. 4]. She would coincide with a countess Liégarde who appears under 27 May in the necrology of Saint-Remy de Reims ["Ledgardis comitissa" Depoin (1908), 596].
     "Date of birth: Unknown.
     "Place of birth: Unknown.
     "Date of death: After 931. Heribert's unnamed wife is mentioned as alive by Flodoard in 931 [Flodoard, Annales, s.a. 931, 51]. If the name of Liégarde is correct, then her death date would be 26×7 May (see above).
     "Place of death: Unknown.
     "Father: Robert I, d. 923, king of France.
     "Mother: Unknown.
     "Spouse: Heribert II, d. 943, count of Meaux, Soissons, and Vermandois.
     "Children: For details on the documentation, see the page of Heribert II.
     "MALE Eudes, d. after 19 June 946, count of Vienne and Amiens.
     "FEMALE Adèle, d. 960, m. 934 Arnulf I, count of Flanders.
     "MALE Heribert "vetulus" ("the old"), d. 980×4 apparently 30 March, abbot of Saint-Médard de Soissons; count of Omois;
m. 951, Eadgifu, daughter of Edward the Elder, king of Wessex, and widow of Charles III of France.
     "MALE Robert, d. after 19 June 966; count of Meaux, 946-; count of Troyes, 956-;
m. 942×950, Adélaïde (Werra), d. after 967, daughter of Giselbert, count of Chalon and Troyes.
     "MALE Albert (Adalbert), d. 8 September, 987 or after, count of Vermandois, 946-987;
m. Gerberge, daughter of Giselbert, duke of Lorriane.
     "FEMALE Liégard, living 16 August 979;
m. (1) ca. 940, Guillaume I, d. 943, duke of Normandy;
m. (2) 943×5, Thibaut I "le Tricheur", d. 16 January 975, count of Blois and Chartres, viscount of Tours.
     "MALE Hugues, b. ca. 920, d. ca. 962, archbishop of Reims, 925-932, 940-6.

Bibliography
     "Anselme = Père Anselme, Histoire généalogique et chronologique de la maison royale de France, 9 vols. (Paris, 1726-33).
     "Chaume (1925) = Maurice Chaume, Les origines du duché de Bourgogne, 4 vols. (Dijon, 1925).
     "Depoin (1908) = Joseph Depoin, "Études préparatoires à l'histoire des familles palatines. III Thibaud le Tricheur - fut-il bâtard et mourut-il presque centenaire?" Revue des études historiques 74 (1908), 553-602.
     "Flodoard, Annales = Ph. Lauer, ed., Les Annales de Flodoard (Paris, 1905).
     "MGH SS = Monumenta Germaniae Historica, Scriptores series.
     "Pinoteau (1958) = Hervé Pinoteau, "Les origines de la maison capétienne", Recueil du IVe congrès international des sciences généalogique et héraldique (Bruxelles, 1958), 240-276.
     "Settipani (1993) = Christian Settipani, La préhistoire des Capétiens 481-987 (Première partie - Mérovingiens, Carolingiens et Robertiens) (Villeneuve d'Ascq, 1993).
     "Werner (1967) = Karl Ferdinand Werner, "Die Nachkommen Karls des Großen bis um das Jahr 1000 (1.-8. Generation)", Karl der Große 4 (1967): 403-483.
Compiled by Stewart Baldwin
     "First uploaded 26 July 2008.
     "Minor update uploaded 23 February 2009: expanded comments on her supposed name."9

Reference: Genealogics cites:
1. Caroli Magni Progenies, Neustadt an der Aisch, 1977 , Rösch, Siegfried. 124.
2. Ancestral Roots of Certain American Colonists who came to America bef.1700, 7th Edition, 1992, Weis, Frederick Lewis. 51.12

Adela/Hildebrante/Liegarde (?) of Neustria, Princess of France was also known as Adele de Capet.10 GAV-28 EDV-29 GKJ-30.

Citations

  1. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, online http://genealogy.euweb.cz/index.html, unknown author (e-mail address), downloaded updated 15 May 2003, Capet 2 page: http://genealogy.euweb.cz/capet/capet2.html
  2. [S1490] Genealogics Website (oiginated by Leo van de Pas, continued by Ian Fettes), online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Adela/Liegarde/Hildebrante of Neustria: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020190&tree=LEO. Hereinafter cited as Genealogics Website.
  3. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, updated 15 May 2003, Carolin 1 page: http://genealogy.euweb.cz/carolin/carolin1.html
  4. [S2203] Foundation for Medieval Genealogy (FMG): MEDIEVAL LANDS - A prosopography of medieval European noble and royal families, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/CAPET.htm#AdelaMHeribertIIVermandois. Hereinafter cited as FMG Medieval Lands Website.
  5. [S2374] Find a Grave, online http://www.findagrave.com/, Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 11 October 2019), memorial page for Aélis du Maine (868–894), Find A Grave Memorial no. 147172864, ; Maintained by Memerizion (contributor 48072664) Unknown, at: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/147172864/a_lis-du_maine. Hereinafter cited as Find a Grave.
  6. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Aelis: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020110&tree=LEO
  7. [S2203] FMG Medieval Lands Website, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/CAPET.htm#RobertIdied923B
  8. [S632] Frederick Lewis Weis, Ancestral Roots of Certain American Colonists Who Came to America before 1700: The Lineage of Alfred the Great, Charlemagne, Malcolm of Scotland, Robert the Strong, and Some of Their Descendants, 7th edition (n.p.: Genealogical Publishing Co., Inc.
    Baltimore, 1992, unknown publish date), line 50-18, p. 51. Hereinafter cited as Weis AR-7.
  9. [S1702] The Henry Project: The ancestors of king Henry II of England, An experiment in cooperative medieval genealogy on the internet, online http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/henry.htm, NN: http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/prov/nn000002.htm. Hereinafter cited as The Henry Project.
  10. [S2374] Find a Grave, online http://www.findagrave.com/, Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 10 November 2019), memorial page for Adele de Capet (unknown–unknown), Find A Grave Memorial no. 143389983, citing Basilique of Saint Quentin, Saint-Quentin, Departement de l'Aisne, Picardie, France ; Maintained by Memerizion (contributor 48072664), at: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/143389983/adele-de_capet
  11. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, Vermandois, Valois & Vexiin, p. 8: http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Vermandois-Valois-Vexin.pdf. Hereinafter cited as Racines et Histoire.
  12. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Adela/Liegarde/Hildebrante of Neustria: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020190&tree=LEO
  13. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Heribert de Vermandois: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00185929&tree=LEO
  14. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Adela de Vermandois: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00018651&tree=LEO
  15. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Flandres.pdf, p. 3.
  16. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Eudes de Vermandois: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00185931&tree=LEO
  17. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Robert de Vermandois: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020191&tree=LEO
  18. [S2203] FMG Medieval Lands Website, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/chamtroyes.htm#Robertdied967
  19. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Blois-Champagne.pdf, p. 2.
  20. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Brabant.pdf, p. 3.
  21. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Adalbert 'the Pious': https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020492&tree=LEO
  22. [S2203] FMG Medieval Lands Website, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/nfravalver.htm#AlbertIdied987B
  23. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Hugues de Vermandois: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00185930&tree=LEO

Heribert I (?) Cte de Vermandois, sn de Senlis, de Peronne et de St.Quentin1,2,3,4

M, #4852, b. between 840 and 850, d. circa 902
FatherPepin II Quentin (?) Cte de Vermandois, sn de Senlis, de Peronne et de St.Quentin2,1,4,5,6 d. a 840
ReferenceGAV29 EDV30
Last Edited20 Apr 2020
     Heribert I (?) Cte de Vermandois, sn de Senlis, de Peronne et de St.Quentin was born between 840 and 850 at Vermandois, Normandy, France; Weis [AR7, line 50-17] says b. ca 840; Genealogy.EU (Carolin 1 page) says b. 848/850; Genealogics says b. ca 850; Med Lands says b. 848/850.5,4,7,1,6,8 He married Bertha (?) de Morvois, Countess of Vermandois, daughter of Guerri I (?) Cte de Morvois and Eve (?) of Roussillon, circa 872; NB: See Note on The Henry Project for a discussion on unlikeliness that Heribert actually married this Bertha de Morvois.
     Genealogics reports this marriage to Bertha, citing:
1. Caroli Magni Progenies, Neustadt an der Aisch, 1977 , Rösch, Siegfried. 105.
2. Ancestral Roots of Certain American Colonists who came to America bef.1700, 7th Edition, 1992, Weis, Frederick Lewis. 51.

     Med Lands reports that me married an otherwise unidentified "Lietgardis".
     Racines et Histoire reports this marriage to Bertha, as well as a second marriage to "Hildebrande (fille de Robert Le Fort)".
I have chosed to include the marriage, but show the mother of Heribert's children as unidentified. GA Vaut.1,4,5,8,9,6,10
Heribert I (?) Cte de Vermandois, sn de Senlis, de Peronne et de St.Quentin died circa 902 at France; murdered; Ravilious says d. 907; Genealogics says d. 900/902; Med Lands says "murdered [900/6 Nov 907]."11,12,1,13,5,6,8
     Heribert I (?) Cte de Vermandois, sn de Senlis, de Peronne et de St.Quentin
Per Wikipedia:
     "Herbert I (c. 848/850 – 907) or Heribertus I, Count of Vermandois, Count of Meaux, Count of Soissons, and lay abbot of Saint Quentin. He was a Carolingian aristocrat who played a significant role in Francia.
     "Herbert was the son of Pepin of Vermandois and one great-grandson of Pepin of Italy, son of Charlemagne. he was possibly matrilineal descendants of Nibelungid. his early life was unknown. Herbert became count of Soissons before 889 and was probably charged with defending the Oise against Viking intrusions. A contemporary of Baldwin II, Count of Flanders he had the advantage of being a Carolingian, a great-grandson of Pepin of Italy, a son of Charlemagne.[1] Herbert controlled both St. Quentin and Péronne and his activities in the upper Somme river valley, such as the capture and murder (rather than ransom) of his brother Raoul in 896, may have caused Baldwin II to have him assassinated in 907.[2]
     "Herbert arranged a marriage alliance to Robert of Neustria by giving in marriage his daughter Beatrice as Robert's second wife.[1] As a part of this pact Herbert also agreed to his son Herbert II of Vermandois marrying Adela, Robert's daughter by his first wife.[1] Another daughter, Cunegonda, married Odo of Wetterau.[3]
Notes
1. Dunbabin 2000, p. 95.
2. Riché 1993, p. 236.
3. McKitterick 1999, p. 360-361.
References
** Dunbabin, Jean (2000). France in the making, 843-1180. Oxford University Press.
** McKitterick, Rosamond (1999). The Frankish Kingdoms under the Carolingians. Pearson Education Limited.
** Riché, Pierre (1993). The Carolingians; A Family who Forged Europe. Translated by Allen, Michael Idomir. University of Pennsylvania Press."14

Heribert I (?) Cte de Vermandois, sn de Senlis, de Peronne et de St.Quentin
Per Med Lands:
     "HERIBERT [I], son of PEPIN [Carolingian] Seigneur de Péronne et de St Quentin, Comte near Paris & his wife --- ([848/850]-murdered [900/6 Nov 907]). Regino names (in order) "Bernardum, Pippinum et Heribertum" as the three children of "Pippinum", specifying that Héribert killed "Rodulfum comitem filium Balduini comitis"[178]. "Heribertus, Bernhardi frater" is named in the Vita Hludowicis Imperatoris[179]. He was at the court of Emperor Charles II “le Chauve” in 877. Comte de Soissons 886/898. Abbé de St Crépin. Comte de Meaux et de Madrie 888/889[180]. He became Comte de Vermandois in 896. The Annales Vedastini record that "Rodulfus comes" disrupted the peace in 896 and took the property of "Heribertus et Erkingerus", that "Odo rex" besieged "castrum sancti Quintini et Peronam" and expelled Raoul's supporters, and that Héribert killed Raoul[181]. Comte Héribert opposed Eudes King of France, but was reconciled with the king in 897, an event which may have been confirmed by the marriage of Héribert's daughter to the king's nephew Robert[182]. Baudouin II Count of Flanders attacked Vermandois, was driven out by 900 but reconquered it and killed Héribert [I] Comte de Vermandois in revenge for his brother's death[183].
     "m [LIETGARDIS], daughter of --- (-27 May ----). The name of the wife of Comte Héribert is not known. However, a "Comtesse Liedgardis", different from the daughter of Comte Héribert [II], is named who could have been his wife[184]. If this is correct, the necrology of Reims which records the death "VI Kal Jun" of "Letgardis comitissa"[185], may refer to the same person[186]. According to the Histoire de Guise, Albert Comte de Vermandois constructed the abbey of Saint-Michel at Rochefort in 945 "d'accord avec la comtesse Hérésinde sa femme", while in 947 Hérésinde founded the nearby Benedictine convent of Bucilly[187]. The source assumes that this refers to Albert Comte de Vermandois, but his supposed marriage to Hérésinde is not mentioned by Settipani[188]. According to the introduction to the Cartulaire de l'abbaye de Bucilly, Bucilly was founded by "Gerberge, femme d'Albert I Comte de Vermandois" although it notes that "certains auteurs ont voulu faire remonter [sa fondation] à la libéralité de Hersinde femme d'Herbert Comte de Vermandois morte en 901"[189]. No other reference has been found to Hérésinde being the wife of Comte Héribert [I].
     "Comte Héribert [I] & his wife had four children:
     "1. HERIBERT [II] ([880]-23 Feb 943, bur Saint Quentin).
     "2. BEATRIX de Vermandois ([880/83]-after 26 Mar 931).
     "3. [daughter [ADELA] .
     "4. [daughter [CUNIGUNDIS] ([890/900]-after 943)."

Med Lands cites:
[178] Reginonis Chronicon 818, MGH SS I, p. 567.
[179] Vita Hludowici Imperatoris, MGH SS II, p. 633.
[180] Settipani (1993), p. 220.
[181] Annales Vedastini 896, MGH SS II, p. 530. .
[182] Settipani (1993), p. 407.
[183] Nicholas (1992), p. 19.
[184] Settipani (1993), p. 408, citing Depoin, J. 'Etudes préparatoires à l'histoire des familles palatines. III. Thibaud le Tricheur fut-il bâtard et mourut-il presque centenaire?', Revue des etudes historiques (1908), p. 595 and footnote 105.
[185] 'Obits mémorables tirés de nécrologes luxembourgeois, rémois et messins', Revue Mabillon VI (1910-1911), p. 274.
[186] Settipani (1993), p. 227 footnote 265.
[187] Pécheur (1851), p. 47, citing "Charte de Raoul évêque de Laon, Lelong, N. Hist. du diocèse de Laon, p. 598".
[188] Settipani (1993), p. 236.
[189] Bucilly, Introduction.6,15


Heribert I (?) Cte de Vermandois, sn de Senlis, de Peronne et de St.Quentin
Per Genealogy.EU: "Cte Herbert I de Vermandois 896, sn de Senlis, de Peronne et de St.Quentin, *ca 848/850, +before 6.11.907; m. Bertha de Morvois /OR Liedgardis N."1

Heribert I (?) Cte de Vermandois, sn de Senlis, de Peronne et de St.Quentin
Per The Henry Project: Heribert I
     "Count of Vermandois, 896-900×6.
     "Count of Soissons and lay-abbot of Saint-Crépin, before 898-900×6.
     "Heribert first appears in 877, when he and his brother Pépin were among those sent by emperor Charles the Bald to prepare for a meeting between the pope and emperor ["Quapropter praemisit Odacrum secundi scrinii notarium, Goiramnum comitem et Pippinum atque Heribertum, ad procuranda ipsius papae servitia." Ann. Bertin., s.a. 877, 136]. In 893, he and Pépin are found with Charles the Simple upon his elevation as king ["Odone rege in Aquitania commemorata, Francorum principes ex permaxima parte ab eo deficiunt, et agnetibus Folcone episcopo, Heriberto et Pippino comitibus, in Remorum civitate Carolus filius Hludowici, ex Adalheide regina, ut supra meminimus, natus, in regnum elevatur." Regino, s.a. 892 (misdated), MGH SS 1: 605]. In 896, Heribert killed Raoul, brother of count Baldwin II [Ann. Vedast., s.a., 896, 78], who had been expelled earlier that year from the countship of Vermandois, and it is probably in this year that Heribert became count of Vermandois and lay-abbot of Saint-Quentin. Heribert last appears in 900 (the year that Annales Vedastini end), and he was killed not long afterward by a follower of Baldwin II of Flanders.
     "Date of Birth: Unknown.
     "Place of Birth: Unknown.
     "Date of Death: 900×906. Regino of Prüm, writing ca. 906, in comments added to the obituary of king Bernard of Italy under the year 818, mentions that Bernard's grandson Heribert had killed count Rodulf, son of Baldwin, in Regino's own time, and that Heribert was killed not long after by a supporter (also named Baldwin) of Rodulf's brother Baldwin [II] of Flanders ["qui Heribertus Rodulfum comitem, filium Balduini interfecit nostris temporibus, et non multum post occisus est a Balduino, satellite Balduini, fratris Rodulfi, qui Balduinus hucusque in Flandris ducatum tenet." Regino, s.a. 818, MGH SS 1: 567]
     "Place of Death: Unknown.
     "Father: Pepin/Pippin, d. after 840, count (near Paris).
     "Mother: Unknown. The conjecture that she was a member of the "Nibelungen" family (descendants of Childebrand, son of Charles Martel) is based on the fact that Heribert I's predecessors in some of his possessions belonged to that family, and on the presence of the name Heribert in that family [see Werner (1960), 101-6].
     "Spouses: Unknown.
See the Commentary section.
Children (very probable):
     "It is rather surprising to see the extent to which modern scholars have glossed over the lack of direct documentation for the relationship between Heribert I and Heribert II. In fact, I did not notice this gap in documentation until the question of documentation for the parentage of Heribert II was raised on the soc.genealogy.medieval/GEN-MEDIEVAL internet newsgroup/mailing list on 13 September 2005 by Steve Barnhoorn, and soon after discussed in more detail by Peter Stewart. Indeed, in his detailed critical study of this family, Karl Ferdinand Werner started his paper by indicating that the Carolingian descent was well documented ["Im Gegnsatz zu den meisten andern westfränkischen Fürstengeschlechtern stellt das Haus Vermandois der Forschung nicht das heikle Problem der Herkunft - zumindest nicht in Mannesstamm. Der karolingische Ursprung ist sicher bezeugt." Werner (1960), 87], followed by a footnote which did in fact document the descent of Heribert I from Charlemagne, but then just stated that Heribert II was a son of Heribert I, without offering any direct documentation there or elsewhere in the paper. Brandenburg (1964) and Settipani (1993), both of them sources which should state such documentation (or at least mention the lack thereof), state the link without documentation or further comment.
     "The earliest source which would appear (at least at first glance) to offer such documentation is an eleventh century Angevin genealogical table, in which Adèle de Troyes, wife of count Geoffroy Grisegonelle of Anjou, is called a daughter of Robert, son of Heribert, son of another Heribert. [Poupardin (1900), 207; see also the page of Heribert's great-granddaughter Adèle, which shows the table] Unfortunately, there is a serious error which undermines this source (which is, of course, not contemporary anyway). In this table, it is the elder Heribert who is stated to be the captor of king Charles the Simple, whereas that deed was actually performed by Heribert II. Because Heribert II did have a son named Heribert, the exact nature of the error remains unclear (is Robert being erroneously assigned as son of his own brother, or was the captor of Charles simply misidentified in an otherwise correct genealogy?), and this source is therefore not good evidence for the parentage of Heribert II.
     "The strongest piece of indirect evidence for Heribert II's parentage is that he is found in possession of the lands which were also held by his namesake Heribert I, e.g. Soissons, Vermandois. Also of note is the statement of the annalist Flodoard that Heribert had a cousin (consobrinus) named Bernard ["..., et Heribertus comes Bernardum, consobrinum suum, cum aliis legatis consilium quod per illos agebatur, ut fertur, ignorantibus, ad Karolum dirigit." Flodoard, Annales, s.a. 923, 15]. Since Heribert I had a brother named Bernard, this also gives good onomastic evidence. Thus, despite the lack of direct documentation for the relationship, it is very probable that Heribert II was the son and successor of Heribert I. (In the unlikely event that Heribert II was not a son of Heribert I, he would in that case almost certainly be a son of either Bernard or Pépin, brothers of Heribert I.)
     "MALE Heribert II, b. say 880, d. 23 February 943, count of Meaux, Soissons, and Vermandois, and abbot of Saint-Crépin and Saint-Médard (Soissons), 900×7-943; m. before 907, Adèle, daughter of Robert of Neustria (later Robert I, king of France).
     "FEMALE NN, m. Udo, count of Wetterau.
An entry in Flodoard's annals for the year 946 shows that Udo (identified as a brother of Hermann) had married an amita of bishop Hugues, also mentioning Arnulf, who had married the bishop's sister ["Videns autem praesul Hugo obsidionem se tolerare non posse, neque tantae resistere multitudini, locutus est cum quibusdam principibus qui videbantur sibi esse amici, videlicet cum Arnulfo, qui ejus sororem, et Uddone, qui amitam ipsius habebat uxorem, sed et cum Hermanno, Uddonis fratre, quaesivit ab eis, quid sibi foret agendum." Flodoard, Annales, s.a. 946, 102]. Since Hugues was a son of Heribert II and Arnulf (I of Flanders) was married to a daughter of Heribert II, Udo's wife would be a sister of Heribert, assuming that amita is to be interpreted in the usual sense as paternal aunt. The suggestion that her name was Cunégonde is an unverified conjecture [See Settipani (1993), 222-3; Jackman (1997), 36, 38]. For the implausible attempt to identify Udo's wife with Béatrix, wife of Robert I of France [Vajay (1980), 770-1], see the page of Béatrix.

Commentary
     "Falsely attributed wife (fictional): Berthe, daughter of Guerri (Wedricus), count of Morvois, and his wife Eva.
     "The main basis of the claim is Historia Walciodorensis Monasterii, a very legendary account of the founder of Waulsort monastery, Ybert de Ribemont (Eilbertus, Elbertus), which includes a fabricated genealogy which, among other false claims, makes this Ybert a brother of count Heribert of Saint-Quentin, and states that Ybert and his brother Heribert were responsible for the famous capture of king Charles the Simple, thus clearly identifying Heribert as Heribert II. Eilbertus and comes Heribertus de Sancto Quintino are listed among the seven supposed sons of Ebroinus by his wife Berta, who brought Florennes to her husband as the daughter of Widricus and Eva. ["... Eius itaque pater comes Ebroinus fuit, vir armis strenuus. Hic armis strenuus et omni honestate preclarus. Iste igitur Ebroinus industria sua et virtute multa acquirens, filiam Wederici comitis et eius uxoris Evae, quae in nominis agnitione Berta nuncupabatur, sumpsit in coniugum, accipiens cum ea, dante ipso genitore atque genetrice, Florinas et quicquid ad eundem pagum Florinensem pertinet. ..." Hist. Walc. Monast., c. 1, MGH SS 14: 505; "... Iste autem Ebroinus ex prefati comitis Wederici et eius uxoris Evae filia, quae, ut superius prefati sumus, Berta dicebatur, septem habuit filios, qui terram longe lateque post decessionem patris tenuerunt hereditario iure et sibi prudentia sua multa acquisierunt. ..." Hist. Walc. Monast., c. 2, MGH SS 14: 505; "Primus itaque in ordine generationis come Eilbertus fuit, maior et natu et dignitate, secundus post hunc comes Uddo de Roix, deinde comes Heribertus de Sancto Quintino, Gerardus de Odenarde, comes Boso, comes Witerus et Macuardus venerabilis episcopus. ..." Hist. Walc. Monast., c. 3, MGH SS 14: 505-6; "Igitur anno ab incarnatione Domini nongentisimo vicesimo secundo Karolus rex Francorum captus ab Eilberto et fratre eius Heriberto usque ad Pernam et ab eisdem sub vinculis carceralis custodiae ibidem diebus multis religatur. ...", Hist. Walc. Monast., c. 5, MGH SS 14: 506].
     "From this starting point, the "logic" on which this false claim is based is easy enough to see. It has been assumed by some authors that the sibling relationship between Ybert and Heribert is at least partly correct, i.e., through their mother. If this argument is accepted, then Ybert's mother Berthe becomes the wife of Heribert I [e.g., Chaume, 1: 543 (table VIII)]. However, the account of Historia Walciodorensis Monasterii is legendary, and attempts to deduce genealogical truths from such legends are not valid. Indeed, for a very different genealogical scenario based on the same legends, see the page of Wigeric, d. 916×9, count of Bidgau, where more details are included.
     "Falsely attributed daughter: FEMALE Béatrix, m. Robert I, d. 923, king of France.
     "The claim that Robert married a sister of Heribert II appears occasionally from the twelfth century on [e.g., "Habebat enim idem Robertus sororem istius Herberti in conjugio; de qua ortus est Hugo Magnus." Historia Francorum Senonensis, MGH SS 9: 366; "..., a Herberto comite, cuius sororem predictus Robertus habebat in uxorem..." Ex Stephanni Normannico Dracone, i, 24, MGH SS 26: 157]. However, since contemporary sources verify that Heribert II was married to Robert's daughter, these later accounts are more likely to be confused accounts of Heribert's marriage. Robert did have a wife named Béatrix, but she was not a daughter of Heribert [see the page of Béatrix for more details]. For the implausible attempt to identify Béatrix with Udo's wife [Vajay (1980), 770-1], see the page of Béatrix.
     "Conjectured daughter (existence doubtful): FEMALE Adèle, m. Gebhard, count of Ulfgau.
[Jackman (1990), 134-5, 178; Jackman (1997), 36, 38] The existence of this supposed daughter is based on a chain of arguments which will only be outlined here. It is closely related to the question of the parentage of Heribert, count of Kinziggau (d. 992) [for whom a page on this website is planned, but as yet unwritten]. In what might be called the "orthodox" account of Heribert's parentage, he is a son of the above marriage of count Udo with a daughter of Heribert I, and there is no need to hypothesize another daughter as a wife of Gerhard (a first cousin of Udo). In what might be called the "alternate" account of Heribert's parentage (proposed notably by Armin Wolf and Donald Jackman), Heribert was a member of another branch of the Konradiner dynasty, a son of Konrad, son of Gebhard of Ulfgau. In this second case, another daughter of Heribert I is hypothesized (and identified with an Adela who appears on a Reichenau memorial list) in order to explain the appearance of the name Heribert in this branch of the Konradiner dynasty. Thus, in order to accept the existence of this daughter, one must first accept the "alternate" scenario of Heribert's parentage, and even then it is still no more than a conjecture.
Bibliography
** Ann. Bertin. = G. Waitz, ed., Annales Bertiniani (MGH SRG 6, Hannover, 1883).
** Ann. Vedast. = B. de Simson, Annales Xantenses et Annales Vedastini (MGH SRG 12, Hannover, 1909).
** Chaume (1925) = Maurice Chaume, Les origines du duché de Bourgogne, (vol. 1, Dijon, 1925).
** Flodoard, Annales = Ph. Lauer, ed., Les Annales de Flodoard (Paris, 1905).
** Jackman (1990) = Donald C. Jackman, The Konradiner. A Study in genealogical methodology (Frankfurt, 1990).
** Jackman (1997) = Donald C. Jackman, Criticism and Critique. Sidelights on the Konradiner (Prosopographica et Genealogica 1, 1997).
** MGH SS = Monumenta Germaniae Historica, Scriptores series.
** Poupardin (1900) = René Poupardin, "Généalogies angevines du XIe siècle", Mélanges d'Archéologie et d'Histoire (Paris, Rome) 20 (1900):199-208.
** Schwager (1994) = Helmut Schwager, Graf Heribert II. von Soissons, Omois, Meaux, Madrie sowie Vermandois (900/06-943) und die Francia (Nord-Frankreich) in der 1. Hälfte des 10. Jahrhunderts (Münchener historische Studien Abteilung mittelalterliche Geschichte, 6, 1994).
** Settipani (1993) = Christian Settipani, La préhistoire des Capétiens 481-987 (Première partie - Mérovingiens, Carolingiens et Robertiens) (Villeneuve d'Ascq, 1993).
** Vajay (1980) = Szabolcs de Vajay, "Comtesses d'origine occitane dans la Marche d'Espagne aux 10e et 11e siècles", Hidalguia 28 (1980): 585-616, 755-788.
** Werner (1960) = Karl Ferdinand Werner, "Untersuchungen zur Frühzeit des französischen Fürstentums (9.-10. Jahrhundert): V. Zur Geschichte des Hauses Vermandois", Die Welt als Geschichte 20 (1960): 87-119.
** Werner (1967) = Karl Ferdinand Werner, "Die Nachkommen Karls des Großen bis um das Jahr 1000 (1.-8. Generation)", Karl der Große 4 (1967): 403-483.
Compiled by Stewart Baldwin
     First uploaded 23 May 2007."9

Heribert I (?) Cte de Vermandois, sn de Senlis, de Peronne et de St.Quentin
Per Racines et Histoire: "Her(i)bert 1er de Vermandois ° ~848/850 + ass. 902/03 ? dès 06/11/907 comte de Vermandois (893/896), seigneur de Senlis, Péronne et Saint-Quentin
     ép.~872 Béatrice (alias Berthe) de Morvois (de Paris)
     ép. Hildebrande (fille de Robert Le Fort.)8"

Heribert I (?) Cte de Vermandois, sn de Senlis, de Peronne et de St.Quentin
Per Wikipedia (Fr.):
     "Herbert Ier de Vermandois, seigneur de Péronne et de Saint-Quentin, né vers 850 et mort entre 900 et 907. Il fut en 888 comte de Meaux, de Madrie, du Vexin, de Mézerais, en 896 comte de Vermandois et abbé de Saint-Quentin, puis vers 896-898 comte de Soissons et abbé de Saint-Crépin, jusqu'à sa mort1. Il était fils de Pépin, petit-fils de Bernard, roi d'Italie.
Biographie
     "Il apparaît en 877 à la cour du roi Charles le Chauve et est cité en 889 comme un fidèle du roi Eudes. Il devient comte de Vermandois en 896, succédant au Nibelungide Théodoric, qui était probablement son grand-père maternel. Dans les années qui suivent, il hérite de plusieurs comtés (Soissons, Meaux et Vexin), tenus par d'autres Nibelungides. Cet ensemble forma une marche militaire créée en 890 pour lutter contre les Normands.
Mariage et enfants
     "Son épouse est inconnue. Des études récentes laissent penser qu'elle se prénommait Leutgarde, et qu'elle serait fille du comte de Troyes Adalelme. Il a eu :
** Herbert II (880 † 943), comte de Vermandois, de Meaux et de Soissons ;
** Béatrice, mariée vers 895 à Robert Ier, roi de France († 923) ;
** Cunégonde, mariée vers 915 à Odon Ier, comte de Wetterau.
Source
** Christian Settipani, La Préhistoire des Capétiens (Nouvelle histoire généalogique de l'auguste maison de France, vol. 1), Villeneuve-d'Ascq, éd. Patrick van Kerrebrouck, 1993, 545 p. (ISBN 978-2-95015-093-6)
Référence
1. Régine Le Jan, Famille et pouvoir dans le monde franc (VIIe-Xe siècle) [archive], Publications de la Sorbonne, 1995, p. 258."16

Reference: Genealogics cites:
1. Caroli Magni Progenies Neustadt an der Aisch, 1977. , Siegfried Rosch, Reference: 105.
2. Ancestral Roots of Certain American Colonists who came to Amercia bef.1700 7th Edition, Frederick Lewis Weis, Reference: 51.5

He was Seigneur of Senlis, Peronne & St. Quentin.4,1 GAV-29 EDV-30 GKJ-31. He was Comte de Soissons between 892 and 907.14 He was Comte de Meaux between 892 and 907.14 He was Comte de Vermandois between 892 and 907.1,3,4,14 He was Comte de Valois between 893 and 895.14

Family 2

Children

Citations

  1. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, online http://genealogy.euweb.cz/index.html, unknown author (e-mail address), downloaded updated 15 May 2003, Carolin 1 page: http://genealogy.euweb.cz/carolin/carolin1.html
  2. [S1490] Genealogics Website (oiginated by Leo van de Pas, continued by Ian Fettes), online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Pippin: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020185&tree=LEO. Hereinafter cited as Genealogics Website.
  3. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Heribert I: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020187&tree=LEO
  4. [S632] Frederick Lewis Weis, Ancestral Roots of Certain American Colonists Who Came to America before 1700: The Lineage of Alfred the Great, Charlemagne, Malcolm of Scotland, Robert the Strong, and Some of Their Descendants, 7th edition (n.p.: Genealogical Publishing Co., Inc.
    Baltimore, 1992, unknown publish date), line 50-17, p. 51. Hereinafter cited as Weis AR-7.
  5. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Heribert I: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020187&tree=LEO
  6. [S2203] Foundation for Medieval Genealogy (FMG): MEDIEVAL LANDS - A prosopography of medieval European noble and royal families, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/nfravalver.htm#HeribertIdied900907. Hereinafter cited as FMG Medieval Lands Website.
  7. [S752] Marcellus Donald Alexander R. von Redlich, compiler, Pedigrees of Some of the Emperor Charlemagne's Descendants, Vol. I (Baltimore: Genealogical Publishing Co., Inc., 1941 (1988 reprint)), p. 120. Hereinafter cited as Charlemagne's Descendants, Vol. I.
  8. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, Vermandois, Valois & Vexin, p. 3: http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Vermandois-Valois-Vexin.pdf. Hereinafter cited as Racines et Histoire.
  9. [S1702] The Henry Project: The ancestors of king Henry II of England, An experiment in cooperative medieval genealogy on the internet, online http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/henry.htm, http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/prov/herib001.htm. Hereinafter cited as The Henry Project.
  10. [S1549] "Author's comment", various, Gregory A. Vaut (e-mail address), to unknown recipient (unknown recipient address), 4 April 2020; unknown repository, unknown repository address. Hereinafter cited as "GA Vaut Comment."
  11. [S632] Frederick Lewis Weis, Weis AR-7, line 50-18, p. 51.
  12. [S753] Jr. Aileen Lewers Langston and J. Orton Buck, compiler, Pedigrees of Some of the Emperor Charlemagne's Descendants, Vol. II (Baltimore: Genealogical Publishing Co., Inc., 1974 (1996 reprint)), p. 17. Hereinafter cited as Langston & Buck [1974] - Charlemagne Desc. vol II.
  13. [S1769] John P. Ravilious, "Ravilious email 12 Aug 2005: "Re: Count Odo/Cunegonde"," e-mail message from e-mail address (unknown address) to e-mail address, 12 Aug 2005. Hereinafter cited as "Ravilious email 12 Aug 2005."
  14. [S1953] Wikipedia: The Free Encyclopedia, online http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herbert_I,_Count_of_Vermandois. Hereinafter cited as Wikipedia.
  15. [S4753] Christian Settipani, La Préhistoire des Capétiens, 481-987, première partie - Mérovingiens, Carolingiens et Robertiens (n.p.: Van Kerrebrouck, 1993), pp. 220, 227 (fn 265), 407-8. Hereinafter cited as Settipani [1993] La Préhistoire des Capétiens.
  16. [S4742] Wikipédia - L'encyclopédie libre, online https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikip%C3%A9dia:Accueil_principal, Herbert Ier de Vermandois: https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herbert_Ier_de_Vermandois. Hereinafter cited as Wikipédia (Fr.).
  17. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, (Adela) de Vermandois: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00313104&tree=LEO
  18. [S2203] FMG Medieval Lands Website, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/nfravalver.htm#AdelaMGebhardKonradiner
  19. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Heribert II: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020189&tree=LEO
  20. [S632] Frederick Lewis Weis, Weis AR-7, line 143-20, pp. 125.
  21. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, (Cunegonde|Kunigunde) de Vermandois: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00726527&tree=LEO

Pepin II Quentin (?) Cte de Vermandois, sn de Senlis, de Peronne et de St.Quentin1,2,3

M, #4853, d. after 840
FatherBernard I (?) King of Italy/Lombards3,2,1 b. c 797, d. 17 Apr 818
MotherCunigunde (?) di Lombardy1,2,3 b. b 797, d. a 15 Jun 835
ReferenceGAV30 EDV30
Last Edited16 Apr 2020
     Pepin II Quentin (?) Cte de Vermandois, sn de Senlis, de Peronne et de St.Quentin was born between 817 and 818 at Peronne, France.1,4
Pepin II Quentin (?) Cte de Vermandois, sn de Senlis, de Peronne et de St.Quentin died after 840 at Milan, Italy.1,4,3
     Pepin II Quentin (?) Cte de Vermandois, sn de Senlis, de Peronne et de St.Quentin
Cte Pepin II Quentin de Vermandois, Cte de Senlis, de Peronne et de St.Quentin, *817, +after 840; m.NN.1

Pepin II Quentin (?) Cte de Vermandois, sn de Senlis, de Peronne et de St.Quentin
Leo van de Pas cites:
1. Caroli Magni Progenies Neustadt an der Aisch, 1977. , Siegfried Rosch, Reference 86
2. Ancestral Roots of Certain American Colonists who came to Amercia bef.1700 7th Edition, Frederick Lewis Weis, Reference: 51.3 Pepin II Quentin (?) Cte de Vermandois, sn de Senlis, de Peronne et de St.Quentin lived at an unknown place ; Per Racines et Histoire: "Pépin II de Vermandois ° 817 + après 840 (~878 Milan) comte de Senlis, Péronne et de Saint-Quentin
ép. Rothaïde de Bobbio ° ~812 + après 858 (Nibelung.)5"

GAV-30 EDV-30 GKJ-31.

Pepin II Quentin (?) Cte de Vermandois, sn de Senlis, de Peronne et de St.Quentin
Stone [2000] Chart 31.6

Family

Children

Citations

  1. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, online http://genealogy.euweb.cz/index.html, unknown author (e-mail address), downloaded updated 15 May 2003, Carolin 1 page: http://genealogy.euweb.cz/carolin/carolin1.html
  2. [S1490] Genealogics Website (oiginated by Leo van de Pas, continued by Ian Fettes), online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Bernhard I: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020183&tree=LEO. Hereinafter cited as Genealogics Website.
  3. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Pippin: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020185&tree=LEO
  4. [S632] Frederick Lewis Weis, Ancestral Roots of Certain American Colonists Who Came to America before 1700: The Lineage of Alfred the Great, Charlemagne, Malcolm of Scotland, Robert the Strong, and Some of Their Descendants, 7th edition (n.p.: Genealogical Publishing Co., Inc.
    Baltimore, 1992, unknown publish date), line 50-17, p. 51. Hereinafter cited as Weis AR-7.
  5. [S2280] Racines et Histoire, online http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/LGN-frameset.html, Vermandois, Valois & Vexin, p. 3: http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Vermandois-Valois-Vexin.pdf. Hereinafter cited as Racines et Histoire.
  6. [S737] Compiler Don Charles Stone, Some Ancient and Medieval Descents (n.p.: Ancient and Medieval Descents Project
    2401 Pennsylvania Ave., #9B-2B
    Philadelphia, PA 19130-3034
    Tel: 215-232-6259
    e-mail address
    or e-mail address
    copyright 1995, 1998, 1999, 2000, unknown publish date), Chart 31, Note 1.
  7. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Heribert I: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020187&tree=LEO
  8. [S2203] Foundation for Medieval Genealogy (FMG): MEDIEVAL LANDS - A prosopography of medieval European noble and royal families, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/nfravalver.htm#HeribertIdied900907. Hereinafter cited as FMG Medieval Lands Website.
  9. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Count Bernhard: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020490&tree=LEO
  10. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Count Pippin: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020491&tree=LEO

Beatrice/Beatrix (?) de Vermandois, Queen of France1,2,3

F, #4854, b. circa 880, d. after March 931
ReferenceGAV29 EDV29
Last Edited3 Apr 2020
     Beatrice/Beatrix (?) de Vermandois, Queen of France was born circa 880 at Vermandois, Normandy, France.3,1,4 She married Robert I (?) Count of Paris, Duke of France, King of the West Franks, son of Robert I "le Fort" (?) Cte de Paris, de Angers et de Tours and Aelis/Adelaide (?) de Tours, circa 890;
His 2nd wife; Leo van de Pas says m. 893.4,5,1,3,6
Beatrice/Beatrix (?) de Vermandois, Queen of France died after March 931.4,1,3
     Beatrice/Beatrix (?) de Vermandois, Queen of France
Leo van der Pas cites: Genealogisches Handbuch des Adels Fürstliche Häuser , Reference: 1961.3 GAV-29 EDV-29 GKJ-30.

Beatrice/Beatrix (?) de Vermandois, Queen of France
(an unknown value.)7,8,9

Citations

  1. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, online http://genealogy.euweb.cz/index.html, unknown author (e-mail address), downloaded updated 15 May 2003, Carolin 1 page: http://genealogy.euweb.cz/carolin/carolin1.html
  2. [S1490] Genealogics Website (oiginated by Leo van de Pas, continued by Ian Fettes), online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Heribert I: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020187&tree=LEO. Hereinafter cited as Genealogics Website.
  3. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Beatrice de Vermandois: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020111&tree=LEO
  4. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, updated 15 May 2003, Capet 2 page: http://genealogy.euweb.cz/capet/capet2.html
  5. [S632] Frederick Lewis Weis, Ancestral Roots of Certain American Colonists Who Came to America before 1700: The Lineage of Alfred the Great, Charlemagne, Malcolm of Scotland, Robert the Strong, and Some of Their Descendants, 7th edition (n.p.: Genealogical Publishing Co., Inc.
    Baltimore, 1992, unknown publish date), lin 53-18, p. 57. Hereinafter cited as Weis AR-7.
  6. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Robert I: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020109&tree=LEO
  7. [S586] Inc. Brøderbund Software, GEDCOM file imported on 24 Oct 1999 from World Family Tree Vol. 11, Ed. 1, Family #3809 (n.p.: Release date: July 1, 1997, unknown publish date).
  8. [S616] Inc. Br²derbund Software, GEDCOM file imported on 26 Dec 1999 from World Family Tree Vol. 18, Ed. 1, Family #18-0770 (n.p.: Release date: March 27, 1998, unknown publish date).
  9. [S636] Inc. Brøderbund Software, GEDCOM file imported on 6 Oct 2000 from World Family Tree Vol. L1, Ed. 1, Family #0043 (n.p.: Release date: October 30, 1998, unknown publish date).
  10. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Hugues 'the Great': https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020106&tree=LEO

Giselbert (?) Duc de Bourgogne, Comte de Châlons sur Saône1,2

M, #4855, b. circa 890, d. 8 April 956
FatherManasses I (?) Count of Auxin, Châlons-sur-Saone, Dijon, Vergy3 b. c 860, d. 31 Oct 920
MotherErmengarde (?) of Burgundy3 b. c 860, d. 12 Apr 935
ReferenceGAV29 EDV30
Last Edited3 May 2020
     Giselbert (?) Duc de Bourgogne, Comte de Châlons sur Saône married Ermengarde (?) Css d'Autun, daughter of Richard II "le Justicier" (?) Duc de Bourgogne, Cte d'Auxerre, Cte de Châlons, de Mâcon, d'Autun, de Sens et de Nevers and Adelheid d'Auxerre (?) Princess of Burgundy.4 Giselbert (?) Duc de Bourgogne, Comte de Châlons sur Saône was born circa 890 at France.5,6 He married Ermengarde (?) Css d'Autun, daughter of Richard II "le Justicier" (?) Duc de Bourgogne, Cte d'Auxerre, Cte de Châlons, de Mâcon, d'Autun, de Sens et de Nevers and Adelheid d'Auxerre (?) Princess of Burgundy, circa 938.7
Giselbert (?) Duc de Bourgogne, Comte de Châlons sur Saône died on 8 April 956.7,2
     GAV-29 EDV-30 GKJ-30.

Giselbert (?) Duc de Bourgogne, Comte de Châlons sur Saône
Leo van de Pas cites: 1. Stammtafeln zur Geschichte der Europäischen Staaten, 4 volumes, Marburg, 1953, 1975., W. K. Prinz von Isenburg, Reference: II 23.2

Giselbert (?) Duc de Bourgogne, Comte de Châlons sur Saône
Gordon Banks cites: 1. Marlyn Lewis, The Ancestry of Elizabeth of York (Arvada, CO: HT Communications, 1999).
2. Frederick Lewis Weis, Ancestral Roots of Certain American Colonists Who Came to America Before1700, 7th ed. (Baltimore: Genealogical Publishing Co., 1999), pp. 118-9.3 Giselbert (?) Duc de Bourgogne, Comte de Châlons sur Saône was also known as Gilbert (?) d'Autun.4

Citations

  1. [S1490] Genealogics Website (oiginated by Leo van de Pas, continued by Ian Fettes), online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Adelheid/Wera de Bourgogne: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020192&tree=LEO. Hereinafter cited as Genealogics Website.
  2. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Giselbert: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00120370&tree=LEO
  3. [S1608] Banks/Dean Genealogy, online http://www.gordonbanks.com/gordon/family/2nd_Site/geb-p/index.htm, Person Page 32: http://www.gordonbanks.com/gordon/family/2nd_Site/geb-p/p32.htm#i1791. Hereinafter cited as Banks/Dean Genealogy.
  4. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, online http://genealogy.euweb.cz/index.html, unknown author (e-mail address), downloaded updated 15 May 2003, Capet 4 page: http://genealogy.euweb.cz/capet/capet4.html
  5. [S602] Inc. Brøderbund Software, World Family Tree Vol. 14, Ed. 1, Family #2699 (n.p.: Release date: October 20, 1997, unknown publish date).
  6. [S640] Inc. Brøderbund Software, World Family Tree Vol. L1, Ed. 1, Family #0021 (n.p.: Release date: October 30, 1998, unknown publish date).
  7. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, updated 15 May 2003, Boson page (Bosonides): http://genealogy.euweb.cz/french/boson.html
  8. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Liégeard de Bourgogne: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00120372&tree=LEO
  9. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, updated 15 May 2003, Carolin 1 page: http://genealogy.euweb.cz/carolin/carolin1.html
  10. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Adelheid|Wera de Bourgogne: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020192&tree=LEO
  11. [S2203] Foundation for Medieval Genealogy (FMG): MEDIEVAL LANDS - A prosopography of medieval European noble and royal families, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/BURGUNDY.htm#AdelaideM1RobertMeauxM2LambertM3Geoffroy. Hereinafter cited as FMG Medieval Lands Website.

Ermengarde (?) Css d'Autun1,2,3

F, #4856, b. circa 893
FatherRichard II "le Justicier" (?) Duc de Bourgogne, Cte d'Auxerre, Cte de Châlons, de Mâcon, d'Autun, de Sens et de Nevers1,4 b. c 858, d. 1 Jan 921
MotherAdelheid d'Auxerre (?) Princess of Burgundy1 b. c 872, d. a 921
ReferenceGAV29 EDV30
Last Edited3 May 2020
     Ermengarde (?) Css d'Autun married Giselbert (?) Duc de Bourgogne, Comte de Châlons sur Saône, son of Manasses I (?) Count of Auxin, Châlons-sur-Saone, Dijon, Vergy and Ermengarde (?) of Burgundy.5 Ermengarde (?) Css d'Autun was born circa 893 at France.6 She was born circa 898.7 She married Giselbert (?) Duc de Bourgogne, Comte de Châlons sur Saône, son of Manasses I (?) Count of Auxin, Châlons-sur-Saone, Dijon, Vergy and Ermengarde (?) of Burgundy, circa 938.1
     Ermengarde (?) Css d'Autun
Leo van de Pas cites: 1. Europäische Stammtafeln, J.A. Stargardt Verlag Marburg., Detlev Schwennicke, Editor, Reference: III-1 Neu ;II 189 wrong.3 GAV-29 EDV-30 GKJ-30. Ermengarde (?) Css d'Autun was also known as Ermengarde (?) heiress of Lower Burgundy.5

Citations

  1. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, online http://genealogy.euweb.cz/index.html, unknown author (e-mail address), downloaded updated 15 May 2003, Boson page (Bosonides): http://genealogy.euweb.cz/french/boson.html
  2. [S1490] Genealogics Website (oiginated by Leo van de Pas, continued by Ian Fettes), online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Giselbert: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00120370&tree=LEO. Hereinafter cited as Genealogics Website.
  3. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Ermengard de Autun: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020460&tree=LEO
  4. [S1953] Wikipedia: The Free Encyclopedia, online http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard,_Duke_of_Burgundy. Hereinafter cited as Wikipedia.
  5. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, updated 15 May 2003, Capet 4 page: http://genealogy.euweb.cz/capet/capet4.html
  6. [S602] Inc. Brøderbund Software, World Family Tree Vol. 14, Ed. 1, Family #2699 (n.p.: Release date: October 20, 1997, unknown publish date).
  7. [S640] Inc. Brøderbund Software, World Family Tree Vol. L1, Ed. 1, Family #0021 (n.p.: Release date: October 30, 1998, unknown publish date).
  8. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Liégeard de Bourgogne: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00120372&tree=LEO
  9. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Adelheid|Wera de Bourgogne: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020192&tree=LEO
  10. [S2203] Foundation for Medieval Genealogy (FMG): MEDIEVAL LANDS - A prosopography of medieval European noble and royal families, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/BURGUNDY.htm#AdelaideM1RobertMeauxM2LambertM3Geoffroy. Hereinafter cited as FMG Medieval Lands Website.

Richard II "le Justicier" (?) Duc de Bourgogne, Cte d'Auxerre, Cte de Châlons, de Mâcon, d'Autun, de Sens et de Nevers1,2

M, #4857, b. circa 858, d. 1 January 921
FatherBuvinus (?) comte de Metz, abbe laique de Gorze1,2 b. 830
MotherRichilde (?) d'Arles1 d. 883
ReferenceGAV29 EDV29
Last Edited18 Nov 2019
     Richard II "le Justicier" (?) Duc de Bourgogne, Cte d'Auxerre, Cte de Châlons, de Mâcon, d'Autun, de Sens et de Nevers was born circa 858;
Genealogy.EU says b. 868. Wikipedia says b. 858; Find A Grave says 858.1,3,4 He married Adelheid d'Auxerre (?) Princess of Burgundy, daughter of Konrad II 'the Younger' (?) Duke of Burgundy, Cte d'Auxerre, Margrave of Transjurania and Waldrada (?), in 888.1,2,3
Richard II "le Justicier" (?) Duc de Bourgogne, Cte d'Auxerre, Cte de Châlons, de Mâcon, d'Autun, de Sens et de Nevers died on 1 January 921 at abbaye de St. Colombe, Sens, France (now).1,5,2
Richard II "le Justicier" (?) Duc de Bourgogne, Cte d'Auxerre, Cte de Châlons, de Mâcon, d'Autun, de Sens et de Nevers was buried after 1 January 921 at Saint-Étienne Cathedral, Sens, Departement de l'Yonne, Bourgogne, France,

; From Find A Grave:
     BIRTH     858, France
     DEATH     921 (aged 62–63), France
     Richard the Justiciar, Count of Autun, Margrave and Duke of Burgundy. Son of Bivin or Budwine, Count of Italy, Lay Abbot of Gorze and Richildis of Arles, grandson of Richard Count of Amiens and Meaux and Boson III, the Elder, a line called the Bosonids. His siblings included Boso of Provence and King of Lower Burgundy and Richildis, the wife of Charles the Bald, the Holy Roman Emperor.
     Richard married Adelaide, the daughter of Conrad II, Count of Auxerre, Waldrada of Worms and Judith, daughter of Eberhard of Friuli. They had the following children:
* Rudolph, his father's successor and King of Francia
* Hught the Black, Duke of Burgundy
* Boso
* Ermengard, married Gilbert, Duke of Burgundy
* Adelaide, married Reginar II, Count of Hainaut
* Richilda, married Litaud I, Count of Macon
     Both brothers accompanied Charles to his imperial coronation in Pavia in February of 876, during which Charles promoted Boso to Duke and Viceroy of Italy. Charles would die in 877, Boso returned to France, entrusting Italy and Provence to Richard as Hugh the Abbot. Louis the Stammer, King of the West Franks died in 879, Boso claimed himself King of Provence, and Richard struck out on his own, taking Boso's Autun, starting the war between the brothers that ended only when Charles and Fat, in cahoots with Richard, captured Boso' wife, Ermengard, and her children, keeping them prisoners at Autun while Boso hid in Provence. Other reports indicate Ermengard took shelter with Richard in fear from Charles, Carloman and Louis III.
     At his death bed, Richard was encouraged to plea for a pardon for the blood he shed, to which he responded,"When I have died a brigand, I have saved the life of honest men, the death of one helping prevent his accomplices from making more evil."
     Family Members
     Parents
      Bivin de Vienne de Provence
      Richilde d'Arles
     Spouse
      Adelaide d'Auxerre
     Siblings
      Boso de Provence
      Richilde d'Ardennes de Provence 845–910
     Children
      Ermengarde de Bourgogne
      Rudolph de Bourgogne
     BURIAL     Saint-Étienne Cathedral, Sens, Departement de l'Yonne, Bourgogne, France
     Maintained by: Anne Shurtleff Stevens
     Originally Created by: Jerry Ferren
     Added: 3 Dec 2010
     Find A Grave Memorial 62475819.1,4
     Reference: Genealogics cites: Europäische Stammtafeln, J.A. Stargardt Verlag Marburg., Detlev Schwennicke, Editor, Reference: III-1 Neu corrections ;II 189 wrong.2


Richard II "le Justicier" (?) Duc de Bourgogne, Cte d'Auxerre, Cte de Châlons, de Mâcon, d'Autun, de Sens et de Nevers
from Wikipedia:
     "Richard, Duke of Burgundy (858–921), also known as Richard of Autun or Richard the Justiciar, was Count of Autun from 880 and the first Margrave and Duke of Burgundy. He eventually attained suzerainty over all the counties of Burgundy save Mâcon and by 890 he was referred to as dux (duke) and by 900 as marchio (margrave). By 918 he was being called dux Burgundionem or dux Burgundiae, which probably signified less the existence of a unified Burgundian dukedom than feudal suzerainty over a multiplicity of counties in a specific region.
Life
     "Richard was a Bosonid, the son of Bivin of Gorze and Richildis. His elder brother was Boso of Provence and his younger sister was Richildis, second wife of Charles the Bald.
     "In 875, after the death of the Emperor Louis II, Richard and Boso accompanied Charles to Italy for his imperial coronation. In February 876, in Pavia, while preparing for his return journey, Charles nominated Boso "Duke and Viceroy of Italy and Duke of Provence". In 877, on Charles' death, Boso returned to France and confided the realm of Italy and the duchy of Provence to Richard and Hugh the Abbot as missi dominici.
     "In 879, Boso declared himself "King of Provence" following the death of Louis the Stammerer, but Richard defected from Boso and took Boso's county of Autun, which Carloman II confirmed to him in 880. The two joined battle on the Saône and Richard captured Mâcon and garrisoned it in the name of Carloman and Louis III under the command of Bernard Plantapilosa, a relative of the hereditary Counts of Mâcon. After taking Lyon, he besieged his brother's capital of Vienne, where he was joined by Louis, Carloman, and the emperor Charles the Fat. Richard eventually drove Boso out in 882 and captured his wife Ermengard and children Engelberga and Louis, sending them as prisoners to Autun. Boso went into hiding in Provence.
     "After the death of Charles the Fat in 888, Richard supported the claim of Duke Rudolph to be King of Upper Burgundy and married his sister Adelaide, daughter of Conrad II of Auxerre. Richard also supported the coronation of his nephew Louis as King of Provence in 890.
     "Richard died and was buried at Sens. He was exhorted by a bishop at his deathbed to beg a pardon for shedding so much blood in his life. He responded:[citation needed]
“When I have killed a brigand, I have saved the life of honest men, the death of one helping prevent his accomplices from making more evil.”

Family
     "By his wife Adelaide (married 888),[1] daughter of Conrad II, Count of Auxerre, and Waldrada of Worms, he had several sons and daughters:
** Rudolph, successor and later King of Francia[2]
** Hugh the Black, later Duke of Burgundy[3]
** Boso,[4] married Bertha, daughter of Boso, Margrave of Tuscany
** Ermengard, married Gilbert, Duke of Burgundy
** Adelaide, married Reginar II, Count of Hainaut
** Richilda, married Litaud I, Count of Mâcon

Notes
1. The Bosonids or Rising to Power in the Late Carolingian Age, Constance B. Bouchard, French Historical Studies, Vol. 15, No. 3 (Spring, 1988), 415.
2. Constance Brittain Bouchard, Sword, Miter, and Cloister: Nobility and the Church in Burgundy, 980–1198, (Cornell University, 1987), 320.
3. Constance Brittain Bouchard, Sword, Miter, and Cloister: Nobility and the Church in Burgundy, 980–1198, 320.
4. Constance Brittain Bouchard, Sword, Miter, and Cloister: Nobility and the Church in Burgundy, 980–1198, 320.
Sources
** Bouchard, Constance B. "The Bosonids or Rising to Power in the Late Carolingian Age." French Historical Studies, Vol. 15, No. 3. (Spring, 1988), pp 407–431.3

Richard II "le Justicier" (?) Duc de Bourgogne, Cte d'Auxerre, Cte de Châlons, de Mâcon, d'Autun, de Sens et de Nevers
Per Med Lands:
     "RICHARD, son of comte BUVINUS [Bouvin] & his wife --- d'Arles (-[31 Aug or 1 or 29 Sep] 921, bur Abbaye de Sainte-Colombe de Sens, Yonne). The Annales Bertiniani name "Richardus frater Bosonis" when recording that, after the capture of Vienne by the forces of King Carloman, he took “uxorem Bosonis et filiam eius” back to “comitatum suum Augustudensem” in 882[2]. Gingins-la-Sarra suggests that Richard was the uterine brother of King Boson, their mother having married secondly Theoderic [VI] “le Trésorier” Comte d´Autun (see the document CAROLINGIAN NOBILITY)[3]. He refers to the testament dated to [Jan 876] of Ekkehard Comte d´Autun, possibly the brother of Theoderic [VI], which names "…Theoderico et Richardo filio eius…" among the beneficiaries[4]. He identifies “Richardo” with the future duke of Burgundy, although there seems to be no basis for assuming that this co-identity is correct other than the name. The name Richard is well-established in the Bosonid family, which does not appear to be the case in the Theoderic/Nibelung family to which Theoderic [VI] belonged, where it was probably recently introduced through Theoderic´s wife (Settipani suggests that she was the sister of King Boson´s father[5]). In addition, Richard Duke of Burgundy named one of his sons Boson, although this is not conclusive for establishing his paternity as the name also appears in Duke Richard´s maternal line. On the other hand, none of the typical names of the Theoderic/Nibelung family appear among the descendants of Duke Richard. In any case, the chronology does not appear favourable. Richard is named as count in 876 (see below). If he had been King Boson´s uterine brother, he could not have been more than ten years old at the time, which is incompatible with his bearing the comital title. Gingins-la-Sarra´s hypothesis cannot be dismissed entirely. However, it is a convoluted interpretation of the otherwise simple statement in the Annales Bertiniani that Richard was King Boson´s brother. Unless further information comes to light in other sources, it is suggested that the simple explanation is the best. An agreement dated Feb 876 of Charles II "le Chauve" King of the West Franks names "Bosonis…ducis et sacri palatii archiministri atque imperiali missi, Richardi comitis…" as present in Italy with the king, although it fails to specify the family relationship between them[6]. "Richardus comes" is named as present in a charter dated 4 Sep 876 under which Emperor Charles II "le Chauve" granted property "villam…Piredus in pago Senonico"[7]. He presumably assumed the role of his brother Boson as missus in Italy in early 877, when the latter was recalled by Emperor Charles II. "Richardi comitis, Teutbaldi comitis, Bernardi comitis" subscribed the charter dated 25 Jul 879 under which "Boso…et coniunx mea Hirmingardi proles imperiales" donated property "in pago Laticense…in villa Lantinus" to the abbey of Montiérender[8]. Comte d’Autun. At first sight, this might appear to provide the missing connection with Theoderic [VI], who was also Comte d´Autun. However, it is recorded that King Boson disputed Theoderic´s right to the county, in which case it is unlikely that he would have awarded it to Theoderic´s son. Richard established himself in the future duchy of Burgundy, north of his brother's realm, with his capital at Autun. “Carlomannus…Rex” restored property “villam Taniacum” to the church of Autun, at the request of “Richardi Comiti Augustodensis”, by charter dated 1 Dec 880, the text ending with “Theodoricus Comes ambasciavit”[9]. He was invested as lay abbot of Saint-Symphorien by Carloman King of the East Franks in 880. He led the Carolingian army which besieged his brother King Boson at Vienne in 882. The counties in Burgundy, except Mâcon, submitted to him. He succeeded his wife's uncle Hugues l'Abbé as Comte d'Auxerre in 886. He was later known as RICHARD "le Justicier" Duke of Burgundy, although it is unlikely that he was considered at the time as founder of a unified duchy of Burgundy as such, rather as the suzerain of various counties who held the title "duke". "Richardo marchione…eius filiis Rodulpho, Hugone atque Bosone…comitibus" were present at the restitution of property at "Tiliniaco et Canavis" by charter dated 5 Sep 901[10]. Guillaume de Jumièges records that Rollo besieged “Carnotenam urbem” [Chartres] but was forced to withdraw by "Richardus Burgundionum dux...cum...Antelmus episcopus"[11]. A charter dated 5 Sep 918 records the restitution of “res Sancti Nazarii sitas in villa...Canavas ad Tiliniacum” to the church of Autun, in the presence of “Domno Richardo...Marchione...et...illius filiis Rodulfo atque Bozone”[12]. The death of "Richardus marchio de Burgundia" is recorded by Flodoard in 921[13]. The Annales S. Benigni Divisionensis record the death "II Kal Sep 921" of "Ricardus comes"[14]. The Historia Francorum Senonensis records the death "Kal Sep" of "Richardus dux Burgundiæ", and his burial "in basilica sanctæ Columbæ"[15]. The sacrementaire of Sens cathedral records the death "III Kal Oct" of "Ricardi comitis"[16]. The necrology of Auxerre cathedral records the death 1 Sep of "Richardus comes"[17].
     "m ([887/88]) ADELAIS, daughter of CONRAD Marquis of Transjurania [Welf] & his wife Waldrada --- (-after 14 Jul 929). "Adeleth…comitissa" donated property "villam Poligniacum in comitatu Warasco" to Autun naming "filii mei Hugonis comitis" by charter dated 24 Apr 922, subscribed by "Hugo comes, Rodulphus comes, Boso comes" and witnessed by "Wallonis comitis…"[18]. Her origin is deduced by her being named as sister of "Rodulfi regis" (Rudolf I King of Burgundy) in the latter's 10 Jun 888 charter[19], as well as in her own 14 Jan 929 grant to Cluny, the 929 charter also naming "Richardi principis domni mei"[20]. After her husband died, she retired to a monastery. She transferred the monastery of Roman-Moutier to the monastery of Cluny by charter dated 14 Jul 929[21].
     "[Mistress (1): ---. As mentioned below, it is likely that Duke Richard's son Gebuin was illegitimate. If this is correct, the name of his mistress is not known.]
Med Lands cites:
[2] Annales Bertiniani III 882.
[3] Gingins-la-Sarra (1851), p. 39.
[4] Saint-Benoît-sur-Loire, XXV, p. 59.
[5] Settipani (1993), p. 366.
[6] Karoli II Conventus Ticinensis, MGH LL 1, p. 528.
[7] RHGF VIII, CCLXV, p. 654.
[8] Recueil Actes Provence, 16, p. 31.
[9] RHGF IX, p. 418.
[10] Autun (Charmasse), Vol. I, 22, p. 35.
[11] Willelmi Gemmetencis Historiæ (Du Chesne, 1619), Liber II, XV, p. 230.
[12] Plancher (1739), Tome I, Preuves, XIX, p.xvi.
[13] Flodoard, 921, MGH SS III, p. 369.
[14] Annales S. Benigni Divionensis 921, MGH SS V, p. 40.
[15] Hugonis Floriacensis, Historia Francorum Senonensis, MGH SS IX, p. 366.
[16] Obituaires de Sens Tome I.1, Eglise cathédrale de Sens, Sacrementaire Sénonais des ix-x siècles, p. 2.
[17] Histoire d´Auxerre, Tome IV, p. 17.
[18] Autun, Vol. I, 10, p. 14.
[19] Cluny, Tome I, 33, p. 39.
[20] Cluny, Tome I, 379, p. 358.
[21] Cluny, Tome I, 379, p. 358.6


Richard II "le Justicier" (?) Duc de Bourgogne, Cte d'Auxerre, Cte de Châlons, de Mâcon, d'Autun, de Sens et de Nevers
Per Genealogy.EU: "Richard II "le Justicier", Duc de Bourgogne, Cte d'Auxerre, Cte de Chalon, de Mâcon, d'Autun 898, de Sens et de Nevers (881-921), *868, +1.1.921, bur abbaye de St.Colombe, Sens; m.888 Adelaide de Bourgogne."7 GAV-29 EDV-29 GKJ-30.

Richard II "le Justicier" (?) Duc de Bourgogne, Cte d'Auxerre, Cte de Châlons, de Mâcon, d'Autun, de Sens et de Nevers
Per Wikipedia:
     "Richard, Duke of Burgundy (858–921), also known as Richard of Autun or Richard the Justiciar, was Count of Autun from 880 and the first Margrave and Duke of Burgundy. He eventually attained suzerainty over all the counties of Burgundy save Mâcon and by 890 he was referred to as dux (duke) and by 900 as marchio (margrave). By 918 he was being called dux Burgundionem or dux Burgundiae, which probably signified less the existence of a unified Burgundian dukedom than feudal suzerainty over a multiplicity of counties in a specific region.
Life
     "Richard was a Bosonid, the son of Bivin of Gorze and Richildis. His elder brother was Boso of Provence and his younger sister was Richildis, second wife of Charles the Bald.
     "In 875, after the death of the Emperor Louis II, Richard and Boso accompanied Charles to Italy for his imperial coronation. In February 876, in Pavia, while preparing for his return journey, Charles nominated Boso "Duke and Viceroy of Italy and Duke of Provence". In 877, on Charles' death, Boso returned to France and confided the realm of Italy and the duchy of Provence to Richard and Hugh the Abbot as missi dominici.
     "In 879, Boso declared himself "King of Provence" following the death of Louis the Stammerer, but Richard defected from Boso and took Boso's county of Autun, which Carloman II confirmed to him in 880. The two joined battle on the Saône and Richard captured Mâcon and garrisoned it in the name of Carloman and Louis III under the command of Bernard Plantapilosa, a relative of the hereditary Counts of Mâcon. After taking Lyon, he besieged his brother's capital of Vienne, where he was joined by Louis, Carloman, and the emperor Charles the Fat. Richard eventually drove Boso out in 882 and captured his wife Ermengard and children Engelberga and Louis, sending them as prisoners to Autun. Boso went into hiding in Provence.
     "After the death of Charles the Fat in 888, Richard supported the claim of Duke Rudolph to be King of Upper Burgundy and married his sister Adelaide, daughter of Conrad II of Auxerre. Richard also supported the coronation of his nephew Louis as King of Provence in 890.
     "Richard died and was buried at Sens. He was exhorted by a bishop at his deathbed to beg a pardon for shedding so much blood in his life. He responded:[citation needed]
“When I have killed a brigand, I have saved the life of honest men, the death of one helping prevent his accomplices from making more evil.”

Family
     "By his wife Adelaide (married 888),[1] daughter of Conrad II, Count of Auxerre, and Waldrada of Worms, he had several sons and daughters:
* Rudolph, successor and later King of Francia[2]
* Hugh the Black, later Duke of Burgundy[3]
* Boso,[4] married Bertha, daughter of Boso, Margrave of Tuscany
* Ermengard, married Gilbert, Duke of Burgundy
* Adelaide, married Reginar II, Count of Hainaut
* Richilda, married Litaud I, Count of Mâcon
Notes
1. The Bosonids or Rising to Power in the Late Carolingian Age, Constance B. Bouchard, French Historical Studies, Vol. 15, No. 3 (Spring, 1988), 415.
2. Constance Brittain Bouchard, Sword, Miter, and Cloister: Nobility and the Church in Burgundy, 980–1198, (Cornell University, 1987), 320.
3. Constance Brittain Bouchard, Sword, Miter, and Cloister: Nobility and the Church in Burgundy, 980–1198, 320.
4. Constance Brittain Bouchard, Sword, Miter, and Cloister: Nobility and the Church in Burgundy, 980–1198, 320.
Sources
* Bouchard, Constance B. "The Bosonids or Rising to Power in the Late Carolingian Age." French Historical Studies, Vol. 15, No. 3. (Spring, 1988), pp 407–431.3 He was duc de Bourgogne (See attached map from Wikipedia: By Marco Zanoli (Sidonius) - Own work, CC BY-SA 4.0, https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?curid=5942847) circa 890.3

Citations

  1. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, online http://genealogy.euweb.cz/index.html, unknown author (e-mail address), downloaded updated 15 May 2003, Boson page (Bosonides): http://genealogy.euweb.cz/french/boson.html
  2. [S1490] Genealogics Website (oiginated by Leo van de Pas, continued by Ian Fettes), online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Richard 'le Justicier': http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020421&tree=LEO. Hereinafter cited as Genealogics Website.
  3. [S1953] Wikipedia: The Free Encyclopedia, online http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard,_Duke_of_Burgundy. Hereinafter cited as Wikipedia.
  4. [S2374] Find a Grave, online http://www.findagrave.com/, Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 12 October 2019), memorial page for Richard Duke of Burgundy (858–921), Find A Grave Memorial no. 62475819, citing Saint-Étienne Cathedral, Sens, Departement de l'Yonne, Bourgogne, France ; Maintained by Anne Shurtleff Stevens (contributor 46947920), at: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/62475819/richard-duke_of-burgundy. Hereinafter cited as Find a Grave.
  5. [S632] Frederick Lewis Weis, Ancestral Roots of Certain American Colonists Who Came to America before 1700: The Lineage of Alfred the Great, Charlemagne, Malcolm of Scotland, Robert the Strong, and Some of Their Descendants, 7th edition (n.p.: Genealogical Publishing Co., Inc.
    Baltimore, 1992, unknown publish date), line 155-18, p. 135. Hereinafter cited as Weis AR-7.
  6. [S2203] Foundation for Medieval Genealogy (FMG): MEDIEVAL LANDS - A prosopography of medieval European noble and royal families, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, Dukes of Burgundy: https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/BURGUNDY.htm. Hereinafter cited as FMG Medieval Lands Website.
  7. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, updated 15 May 2003, Bosonides: http://genealogy.euweb.cz/french/boson.html
  8. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Richilde/Richeut d'Autun: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00208294&tree=LEO

Adelheid d'Auxerre (?) Princess of Burgundy1

F, #4858, b. circa 872, d. after 921
FatherKonrad II 'the Younger' (?) Duke of Burgundy, Cte d'Auxerre, Margrave of Transjurania2,1,3,4 b. c 805, d. b 876
MotherWaldrada (?)5,1 b. 801
ReferenceGAV29 EDV29
Last Edited16 Apr 2020
     Adelheid d'Auxerre (?) Princess of Burgundy was born circa 872 at Auxerre, Departement de l'Yonne, Bourgogne, France (now); Wikipedia says b. 865-870.6,7,8,9 She married Richard II "le Justicier" (?) Duc de Bourgogne, Cte d'Auxerre, Cte de Châlons, de Mâcon, d'Autun, de Sens et de Nevers, son of Buvinus (?) comte de Metz, abbe laique de Gorze and Richilde (?) d'Arles, in 888.10,11,12
Adelheid d'Auxerre (?) Princess of Burgundy died after 921 at Departement de l'Yonne, Bourgogne, France (now); Note on Find A Grave says d. 14 Sept 929.1,8
Adelheid d'Auxerre (?) Princess of Burgundy was buried after 921 at Saint-Étienne Cathedral, Sens, Departement de l'Yonne, Bourgogne, France,

; From Find A Grave:
     BIRTH     unknown, Auxerre, Departement de l'Yonne, Bourgogne, France
     DEATH     unknown, Departement de l'Yonne, Bourgogne, France
     Death:9/14/929
     Married 888
     Family Members
     Parents
          Conrad II le Jeune d'Auxerre unknown–876
          Waldrada d'Orleans 801 – unknown
     Spouse
          Richard Duke of Burgundy 858–921
     Half Siblings
          Robert The Strong of Orleans 820–866
     Children
          Ermengarde de Bourgogne
          Rudolph de Bourgogne
     BURIAL     Saint-Étienne Cathedral, Sens, Departement de l'Yonne, Bourgogne, France
     Created by: Memerizion
     Added: 26 Mar 2015
     Find A Grave Memorial 144193639.8
     Reference: Genealogics cites: Europäische Stammtafeln, J.A. Stargardt Verlag Marburg., Detlev Schwennicke, Editor, Reference: III-1 189.1


Adelheid d'Auxerre (?) Princess of Burgundy
Per Wikipedia:
     "Adelaide of Auxerre (born between 865[1] - 870) was a Duchess consort of Burgundy in the Middle Ages. She was the daughter of Conrad II, Duke of Transjurane Burgundy[2] and his wife Waldrada of Worms. In 888, she married Richard, Duke of Burgundy. They had probably three or five children :
** Rudolph of France,[3] who married Emma of France, daughter of Robert I of France
** Hugh the Black[4]
** Boson (895-935)
** Adelaide of Burgundy, married Reginar II, Count of Hainaut.
** Ermengarde of Burgundy (born c. 905 and died c. 945)

Notes
1. Christian Settipani, La Noblesse du Midi Carolingien. Études sur quelques grandes familles d'Aquitaine et du Languedoc, du IXe au XIe siècles. Toulousain, Périgord, Limousin, Poitou, Auvergne, Linacre College, Unit for Prosopographical Research, 2004, p. 27 (lire en ligne).
2. Timothy Reuter. The Annals of Fulda.
3. Constance B. Bouchard. The Bosonids or Rising to Power in the Late Carolingian Age.
4. Constance B. Bourchard, Those of my Blood: Constructing Noble Families in Medieval Francia (University of Pennsylvania Press, 2001.)9"



Adelheid d'Auxerre (?) Princess of Burgundy
Per Med Lands:
     "ADELAIS (-after 14 Jul 929). "Adeleth…comitissa" donated property "villam Poligniacum in comitatu Warasco" to Autun naming "filii mei Hugonis comitis" by charter dated 24 Apr 922, subscribed by "Hugo comes, Rodulphus comes, Boso comes" and witnessed by "Wallonis comitis…"[92]. Her origin is deduced by her being named as sister of "Rodulfi regis" (Rudolf I King of Burgundy) in the latter's 10 Jun 888 charter[93], as well as in her own 14 Jan 929 grant to Cluny, the 929 charter also naming "Richardi principis domni mei"[94]. After her husband died, she retired to a monastery. She transferred the monastery of Roman-Moutier to the monastery of Cluny by charter dated 14 Jul 929[95]. m ([887/88]) RICHARD Comte d'Autun, son of comte BUVINUS [Bouvin] & his wife --- d'Arles (-1 Jan 921, bur Sens, abbaye de Sainte-Colombe). He was later known as RICHARD "le Justicier" Duke of Burgundy.
Med Lands cites:
[92] Dijon Saint-Bénigne I, 151, p. 169, headed "Acte suspect" in the compilation which refers to Ademar as "comte" in the title although this is not reflected in the text reproduced.
[93] Dijon Saint-Bénigne I, 179, p. 184.
[94] Dijon Saint-Bénigne I, 151, p. 169, headed "Acte suspect" in the compilation which refers to Ademar as "comte" in the title although this is not reflected in the text reproduced.
[95] Dijon Saint-Bénigne I, 151, p. 169, headed "Acte suspect" in the compilation which refers to Ademar as "comte" in the title although this is not reflected in the text reproduced.13
GAV-29 EDV-29 GKJ-30. Adelheid d'Auxerre (?) Princess of Burgundy was also known as Adelheid (?) d'Auxerre.1 She was living in 921.1

Citations

  1. [S1490] Genealogics Website (oiginated by Leo van de Pas, continued by Ian Fettes), online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Adelheid d'Auxerre: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020422&tree=LEO. Hereinafter cited as Genealogics Website.
  2. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Konrad II: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020419&tree=LEO
  3. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, online http://genealogy.euweb.cz/index.html, unknown author (e-mail address), downloaded updated 15 May 2003, Welf 1 page - The House of Welfen: http://genealogy.euweb.cz/welf/welf1.html
  4. [S2203] Foundation for Medieval Genealogy (FMG): MEDIEVAL LANDS - A prosopography of medieval European noble and royal families, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/BURGUNDY%20KINGS.htm#ConradAuxerreMWaldrada. Hereinafter cited as FMG Medieval Lands Website.
  5. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, updated 15 May 2003, Welf 1 page (The House of Welfen): http://genealogy.euweb.cz/welf/welf1.html
  6. [S602] Inc. Brøderbund Software, World Family Tree Vol. 14, Ed. 1, Family #2699 (n.p.: Release date: October 20, 1997, unknown publish date).
  7. [S632] Frederick Lewis Weis, Ancestral Roots of Certain American Colonists Who Came to America before 1700: The Lineage of Alfred the Great, Charlemagne, Malcolm of Scotland, Robert the Strong, and Some of Their Descendants, 7th edition (n.p.: Genealogical Publishing Co., Inc.
    Baltimore, 1992, unknown publish date), line 155-18, p. 135. Hereinafter cited as Weis AR-7.
  8. [S2374] Find a Grave, online http://www.findagrave.com/, Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 18 November 2019), memorial page for Adelaide d'Auxerre (unknown–unknown), Find A Grave Memorial no. 144193639, citing Saint-Étienne Cathedral, Sens, Departement de l'Yonne, Bourgogne, France ; Maintained by Memerizion (contributor 48072664), at: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/144193639/adelaide-d_auxerre. Hereinafter cited as Find a Grave.
  9. [S1953] Wikipedia: The Free Encyclopedia, online http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adelaide_of_Auxerre_(born_c._870). Hereinafter cited as Wikipedia.
  10. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, updated 15 May 2003, Boson page (Bosonides): http://genealogy.euweb.cz/french/boson.html
  11. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Richard 'le Justicier': http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020421&tree=LEO
  12. [S1953] Wikipedia, online http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard,_Duke_of_Burgundy.
  13. [S2203] FMG Medieval Lands Website, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/BURGUNDY%20KINGS.htm#AdelaideMRichardBurgundy
  14. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Richilde/Richeut d'Autun: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00208294&tree=LEO

Buvinus (?) comte de Metz, abbe laique de Gorze1

M, #4859, b. 830
ReferenceGAV30 EDV30
Last Edited12 Oct 2019
     Buvinus (?) comte de Metz, abbe laique de Gorze married Richilde (?) d'Arles, daughter of Boson "l'Ancien" (?) Cte de Valois and Engeltrude (?) d'Amiens.2 Buvinus (?) comte de Metz, abbe laique de Gorze was born in 830 at Amiens, Departement de la Somme, Picardie, France (now).2,3
Buvinus (?) comte de Metz, abbe laique de Gorze was buried after 868 at St. Stephen's Church, Gorze, Departement de la Moselle, Lorraine, France,

; From Find A Grave:
     BIRTH     unknown, Amiens, Departement de la Somme, Picardie, France
     DEATH     unknown, Metz, Departement de la Moselle, Lorraine, France
     Birth:810, Death:863. King of Provence, Count of Autun, Metz & Vienne, Count in the Ardennengouw, Count of Ardenne. Bivin or Budwine, Count of Italy, Lay Abbot of Gorze.
     Family Members
     Parents
      Richard d'Amiens
     Spouse
      Richilde d'Arles
     Children
      Boso de Provence
      Richilde d'Ardennes de Provence 845–910
      Richard Duke of Burgundy 858–921
     BURIAL     St Stephen's Church, Gorze, Departement de la Moselle, Lorraine, France
     Created by: Memerizion
     Added: 29 May 2015
     Find A Grave Memorial 147146983.3
     Buvinus (?) comte de Metz, abbe laique de Gorze was also known as Bivin of Gorze, Count of the Ardennes.4,5

Buvinus (?) comte de Metz, abbe laique de Gorze
(an unknown value.)6 GAV-30 EDV-30 GKJ-31. Buvinus (?) comte de Metz, abbe laique de Gorze was also known as Theodore (?) d'Ardennes. Buvinus (?) comte de Metz, abbe laique de Gorze was also known as Budwine (?) Count of Metz.6 Buvinus (?) comte de Metz, abbe laique de Gorze was also known as Bivin (?) Cte d'Ardenne.2 He was living between 842 and 862.1

Citations

  1. [S1779] J Bunot, "Bunot email 24 Jan 2005: "Re: d'Auvergne -> Toulouse or Arles"," e-mail message from e-mail address (unknown address) to e-mail address, 24 Jan 2005. Hereinafter cited as "Bunot email 24 Jan 2005."
  2. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, online http://genealogy.euweb.cz/index.html, unknown author (e-mail address), downloaded updated 15 May 2003, Boson page (Bosonides): http://genealogy.euweb.cz/french/boson.html
  3. [S2374] Find a Grave, online http://www.findagrave.com/, Find A Grave, database and images (https://www.findagrave.com : accessed 12 October 2019), memorial page for Bivin de Vienne de Provence (unknown–unknown), Find A Grave Memorial no. 147146983, citing St Stephen's Church, Gorze, Departement de la Moselle, Lorraine, France ; Maintained by Memerizion (contributor 48072664), at: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/147146983/bivin-de_vienne-de_provence. Hereinafter cited as Find a Grave.
  4. [S1953] Wikipedia: The Free Encyclopedia, online http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richilde_of_Provence. Hereinafter cited as Wikipedia.
  5. [S1953] Wikipedia, online http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bivin_of_Gorze
  6. [S632] Frederick Lewis Weis, Ancestral Roots of Certain American Colonists Who Came to America before 1700: The Lineage of Alfred the Great, Charlemagne, Malcolm of Scotland, Robert the Strong, and Some of Their Descendants, 7th edition (n.p.: Genealogical Publishing Co., Inc.
    Baltimore, 1992, unknown publish date), line 49-16, p. 50. Hereinafter cited as Weis AR-7.
  7. [S1953] Wikipedia, online http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boso_of_Provence
  8. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, updated 15 May 2003, Carolin 1 page: http://genealogy.euweb.cz/carolin/carolin1.html
  9. [S1490] Genealogics Website (oiginated by Leo van de Pas, continued by Ian Fettes), online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Richeut/Richardis: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00120075&tree=LEO. Hereinafter cited as Genealogics Website.
  10. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Buvinus (Bouvin): http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00120448&tree=LEO
  11. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Richard 'le Justicier': http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020421&tree=LEO

Konrad II 'the Younger' (?) Duke of Burgundy, Cte d'Auxerre, Margrave of Transjurania1,2

M, #4860, b. circa 805, d. before 876
FatherKonrad I 'the Elder' (?) Count of Auxerre, Graf in Argengau und Linzgau3,1,2,4,5,6 b. c 810, d. 16 Feb 863
MotherAelis/Adelaide (?) de Tours3,1,2,4,7 b. 819, d. a Sep 866
ReferenceGAV30 EDV30
Last Edited17 Apr 2020
     Konrad II 'the Younger' (?) Duke of Burgundy, Cte d'Auxerre, Margrave of Transjurania married Judith (?) of Friuli, daughter of Eberhard I (?) Margrave of Friaul and Gisle (?) de Francia.8 Konrad II 'the Younger' (?) Duke of Burgundy, Cte d'Auxerre, Margrave of Transjurania was born circa 805.9 He married Waldrada (?), daughter of Adrian (?) Count of Orléans and Waldrada (?), after 834;
Her 2nd husbad; his 2nd wife. Her 1st husband d. 834.10,1,11,12
Konrad II 'the Younger' (?) Duke of Burgundy, Cte d'Auxerre, Margrave of Transjurania died before 876.1
Konrad II 'the Younger' (?) Duke of Burgundy, Cte d'Auxerre, Margrave of Transjurania died in 881.13
     Konrad II 'the Younger' (?) Duke of Burgundy, Cte d'Auxerre, Margrave of Transjurania
NB: Genealogics has two listings for a Konrad II:
     Listing #1: 1. Konrad II, Markgraf of Bourgogne, Count d'Auxerre - no parents shown, d. 881.
Genealogics listing #1 cites: Europäische Stammtafeln, J.A. Stargardt Verlag Marburg., Detlev Schwennicke, Editor, Reference: VI 1.

     Listing #2: 1. Konrad II, Count of Auxerre, son of Konrad I & Aelis de Tours, c830-bef 876.
Genealogics listing #2 cites:
1. Europäische Stammtafeln, J.A. Stargardt Verlag, Marburg, Schwennicke, Detlev (Ed.) 3:736.
2. Europäische Stammtafeln, Band I, Frank Baron Freytag von Loringhoven, 1975, Isenburg, W. K. Prinz von. Tafel 11.
3. Europäische Stammtafeln, Band II, Frank Baron Freytag von Loringhoven, 1975, Isenburg, W. K. Prinz von. Tafel 23.
4. Biogr. details drawn from Wikipedia.

I have chosen to follow Genealogics Listing #2 which agrees with Med Lands. GA Vaut.14,15,12

GAV-30 EDV-30 GKJ-31. He was Markgraf of Bourgogne, Count d'Auxerre.13

Reference: Genealogics cites:
1. Stammtafeln zur Geschichte der Europäischen Staaten, 4 volumes, Marburg, 1953, 1975., W. K. Prinz von Isenburg, Reference: I 11; II 23.
2. Europäische Stammtafeln, J.A. Stargardt Verlag Marburg., Detlev Schwennicke, Editor, Reference: III 736.1



Konrad II 'the Younger' (?) Duke of Burgundy, Cte d'Auxerre, Margrave of Transjurania
Per Wikipedia:
     "Conrad II the Younger was the Count of Auxerre from 864 until his death in 876. He was a son of Conrad I of Auxerre, and Adelaide of Tours; an older brother of Hugh the Abbot; and a member of the Bavarian branch of the Welfs.
     "In 858, at the coaxing of Charles the Bald, his cousin, he and his brother betrayed Louis the German when he sent them on an espionage mission and went over to Charles, who rewarded them handsomely because he had lost his Bavarian honores. He acted as Duke of Transjurane (Upper) Burgundy from then until about 864.
     "He married Judith, daughter of Eberhard of Friuli, and later Waldrada of Worms, by whom he left a son, Rudolf,[1] who later became King of Transjurane Burgundy, and a daughter, Adelaide of Auxerre, who married Richard, Duke of Burgundy, and had issue.
References
1. Poupardin 1964, p. 63.
Sources
** Poupardin, Rene (1964). "The Carolingian Kingdoms (877-913)". In Gwatkin, H.M; Whitney, J.P; Tanner, J.R; Previte-Orton, C.W. (eds.) Cambridge Medieval History: Germany and the Western Empire. III. Cambridge at the University Press."4

Konrad II 'the Younger' (?) Duke of Burgundy, Cte d'Auxerre, Margrave of Transjurania was also known as Konrad II Markgraf of Bourgogne, Count d'Auxerre.13 Konrad II 'the Younger' (?) Duke of Burgundy, Cte d'Auxerre, Margrave of Transjurania was also known as Conrad II 'the Younger' (?) Duke of Transjurane Burgundy.4 Konrad II 'the Younger' (?) Duke of Burgundy, Cte d'Auxerre, Margrave of Transjurania was also known as Conrad Cte d'Auxerre, Margrave of Transjurania.10

Konrad II 'the Younger' (?) Duke of Burgundy, Cte d'Auxerre, Margrave of Transjurania
Per Med Lands:
     "CONRAD, son of CONRAD [Welf] Comte de Paris & his wife --- (-876). His parentage is deduced from Regino who names "Ruodolfus filius Chuonradi, nepos Huggonis abbatis"[87], the latter being recorded in the Miraculis Sancti Germani as "Hugo" one of the sons of "Chuonradus princeps", the patron of the church of Saint-Germain at Auxerre[88]. He helped save Charles II "le Chauve" King of the West Franks after the invasion of Ludwig II "der Deutsche" King of the East Franks. Comte d'Auxerre. He fell into disgrace in 861, and passed into the service of the sons of Emperor Lothaire. He received from King Louis II the territories of Geneva, Lausanne and Sion. Marquis of Transjurania (which later evolved into the kingdom of Burgundy) in Dec 864 after he killed comte Hubert [Bosonide][89].
     "m WALDRADA, daughter of ---. Louis III "le Bègue" King of the West Franks confirmed the property of the abbey of Saint-Germain d'Auxerre, including property "villam…Modolaius" and the church built there donated by "Conradus comes…mulieris suæ Vadraldæ", by charter dated 29 Jan 877[90]."
Med Lands cites:
[87] Reginonis Chronicon 888, MGH SS I, p. 598.
[88] Ex Heirici Miraculis S. Germani 5, MGH SS XIII, p. 402.
[89] Settipani (1993), p. 383 footnote 150.12

Konrad II 'the Younger' (?) Duke of Burgundy, Cte d'Auxerre, Margrave of Transjurania was a witness to the      NB. There seems to be some confusion about which Konrad II was the son of Konrad I Count of Auxerre. Genealogics, Med Lands and Wikipedia seem to agree on a Konrad II, son of Konrad I, and who m. Waldrada. Wikipedia also shows Konrad II as having married both: m1. Judith of Friuli (a daughter of Eberhard of Friuli), and later m2. Waldrada of Worms.
     Genealogics has a Konrad II (c830-bef876) , son of Konrad I, who m. Waldrada/Vaudree. This Konrad I had a son Rudolf I, King of Upper Bourgogne, and a dau. Adelheid d'Auxerre (who m. Richard 'le Justicier', Count of Autun and Duke of Burgundy.
     Med Lands, has a Conrad, son of Conrad (Welf) who m. Waldrada and had a son Rudolf I, King of Upper Burgundy, and a dau. Adelais who m. Richard comte d'Autun.
     Wikipedia (regarding Conrad I and II) shows a Conrad I 'the Elder' who had a son Conrad II 'the Younger' who "married Judith, daughter of Eberhard of Friuli, and later Waldrada of Worms" and who had the same son, Rudolf, and dau., Adelaide.

     The confusion seems to lie when examining the proposals of those who attribute the Adeldunde who m. Ehrenfried I, Graf von Bliesgau, to a "Konrad of Burgundy".
     Wikipedia (regarding Ehrenfried I) says that Ehrenfried m. "Adelgunde of Burgundy (860–902), a daughter of Conrad II, Duke of Transjurane Burgundy, Count of Auxerre, and Judith de Frioul." However, the Wikipedia page for this Conrad II (see above) does not list a dau. named Adelgunde for that Conrad II.
     Genealogy.EU (Cleves 2) says: "Erenfried I, Gf im Bliesgau und Charmois, fl 866/904; m. Adelgunde, dau. of Konrad of Burgundy, and left issue"
     Wikipedia (regarding Eberhard of Friuli) says that Eberhard had a dau. "Judith of Friuli (died ca. 881), first married Arnulf I of Bavaria, second married Conrad II of Auxerre."

     I have chosen to show Konrad II 'the Younger' as having m1. Judith of Friuli (a daughter of Eberhard of Friuli), and later m2. Waldrada of Worms. I choose to show Adelgunde as the dau. of his first marriage with Judith and Rudolf & Adelheid as the children of his second marriage with Waldrada. GA Vaut

with Konrad I 'the Elder' (?) Count of Auxerre, Graf in Argengau und Linzgau.9,12,4,16,17,18,19,20,21

Family 1

Child

Family 3

Judith (?) of Friuli b. c 835
Child

Citations

  1. [S1490] Genealogics Website (oiginated by Leo van de Pas, continued by Ian Fettes), online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Konrad II: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020419&tree=LEO. Hereinafter cited as Genealogics Website.
  2. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, online http://genealogy.euweb.cz/index.html, unknown author (e-mail address), downloaded updated 15 May 2003, Welf 1 page - The House of Welfen: http://genealogy.euweb.cz/welf/welf1.html
  3. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Konrad I: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020396&tree=LEO
  4. [S1953] Wikipedia: The Free Encyclopedia, online http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conrad_II,_Duke_of_Transjurane_Burgundy. Hereinafter cited as Wikipedia.
  5. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, updated 15 May 2003, Welf I page (The House of Welfen): http://genealogy.euweb.cz/welf/welf1.html
  6. [S2203] Foundation for Medieval Genealogy (FMG): MEDIEVAL LANDS - A prosopography of medieval European noble and royal families, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/WURTTEMBERG.htm#ConradIParisdiedafter862. Hereinafter cited as FMG Medieval Lands Website.
  7. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Aelis de Tours: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020389&tree=LEO
  8. [S812] e-mail address, online http://worldconnect.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?db=bferris, Jr. William R. Ferris (unknown location), downloaded updated 4 Apr 2002, http://worldconnect.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=GET&db=bferris&id=I44679
  9. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Konrad II: https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020419&tree=LEO
  10. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, updated 15 May 2003, Welf 1 page (The House of Welfen): http://genealogy.euweb.cz/welf/welf1.html
  11. [S1953] Wikipedia, online http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waldrada_of_Worms
  12. [S2203] FMG Medieval Lands Website, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/BURGUNDY%20KINGS.htm#ConradAuxerreMWaldrada
  13. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Konrad II: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00120332&tree=LEO
  14. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Konrad II (Listing #1): https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00120332&tree=LEO
    Konrad II (Listing #2): https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020419&tree=LEO
  15. [S1549] "Author's comment", various, Gregory A. Vaut (e-mail address), to unknown recipient (unknown recipient address), 14 April 2020; unknown repository, unknown repository address. Hereinafter cited as "GA Vaut Comment."
  16. [S1953] Wikipedia, online http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conrad_I,_Count_of_Auxerre.
  17. [S1953] Wikipedia, online http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Erenfried_I
  18. [S1438] Miroslav Marek, updated 15 May 2003, Cleves 2 page (The Ezzon Family - Die Ezzonen): http://genealogy.euweb.cz/cleves/cleves2.html
  19. [S1953] Wikipedia, online http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eberhard_of_Friuli
  20. [S1549] Gregory A. Vaut, "GA Vaut Comment", 14 Jan 2020.
  21. [S2203] FMG Medieval Lands Website, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/WURTTEMBERG.htm#ConradAuxerreMWaldrada
  22. [S632] Frederick Lewis Weis, Ancestral Roots of Certain American Colonists Who Came to America before 1700: The Lineage of Alfred the Great, Charlemagne, Malcolm of Scotland, Robert the Strong, and Some of Their Descendants, 7th edition (n.p.: Genealogical Publishing Co., Inc.
    Baltimore, 1992, unknown publish date), line 192-17, p. 164. Hereinafter cited as Weis AR-7.
  23. [S2203] FMG Medieval Lands Website, online http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/index.htm, https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/BURGUNDY%20KINGS.htm#AdelaisMbefore915LouisIIIProvence
  24. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Adelheid d'Auxerre: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020422&tree=LEO
  25. [S1490] Genealogics Website, online http://www.genealogics.org/index.php, Rudolf I: http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00020435&tree=LEO